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Fraunhofer has begun marketing HD-AAC, ISO MPEG-4 AAC-LC & SLS
rpp3po
post Jan 11 2010, 23:41
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QUOTE (Garf @ Jan 11 2010, 21:48) *
I'm not sure what you mean by unlicensed, but MPEG 4 SLS is an ISO standard and can be implemented by anyone.


I'm not going to implement it, are you? I'm talking about their software, a command line encoder and decoder for example, that everyone can play around with. A frontend here, a Foobar wrapper plugin there... Let people play freely with it. Until it doesn't get too commercial you can allow stuff to stay beneath your radar and let it build your momentum. When you have reached sufficient market share, you can still tighten your policies.

This post has been edited by rpp3po: Jan 12 2010, 00:28
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Garf
post Jan 11 2010, 23:52
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QUOTE (rpp3po @ Jan 11 2010, 23:41) *
QUOTE (Garf @ Jan 11 2010, 21:48) *
I'm not sure what you mean by unlicensed, but MPEG 4 SLS is an ISO standard and can be implemented by anyone.


I'm not going to implement it, are you?


If it wasn't patented up the wazoo with royalties asked even for free implementations, that might happen (by me or anyone, for that matter).

As it is now, why bother?
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Kvanto
post Feb 18 2010, 03:32
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Does anyone tried to compile reference mpeg4 sls encoder? It probably crappy, but still interesting to see how well its result backward compatible with existing software/hardware etc.

This post has been edited by Kvanto: Feb 18 2010, 03:33
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Larson
post Mar 11 2010, 13:02
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JESMLDu_AyM...player_embedded

i didn't see this video,HD-AAC at CES 2010.

I wonder if Apple will use this. This HD-AAC may be a good "universal" lossless format supported natively on all platforms,both Windows and Mac OS (etcs) since they support AAC. We have to wait and see if this encoder appears in some application. I would love flac to be the universal lossless though,but as far as we go there is no native support from both Microsoft and Apple and good part of hardware vendors,by now.

This post has been edited by Larson: Mar 11 2010, 13:03
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darkbyte
post Nov 14 2011, 18:16
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As i've read somewhere the next version of Winamp may include a HD-AAC encoder from Fraunhofer. Are there any sources where i can read about when will the next version of Winamp released? smile.gif
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menno
post Nov 14 2011, 19:21
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Nero 11 includes HD-AAC encoding (in Recode).
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darkbyte
post Nov 14 2011, 20:58
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QUOTE (menno @ Nov 14 2011, 20:21) *
Nero 11 includes HD-AAC encoding (in Recode).

ohmy.gif Are there any plans to make this available in the CLI AAC encoder? smile.gif

Also is there any player which supports the direct playback?

This post has been edited by darkbyte: Nov 14 2011, 21:01
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menno
post Nov 14 2011, 21:23
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All Nero 11 applications will be able to playback/decode the HD-AAC files. Not sure about any other software.
We're looking into releasing this for the CLI encoder as well.
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darkbyte
post Nov 14 2011, 22:20
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QUOTE (menno @ Nov 14 2011, 22:23) *
All Nero 11 applications will be able to playback/decode the HD-AAC files. Not sure about any other software.
We're looking into releasing this for the CLI encoder as well.

That's awesome, thank you! Can't wait to test it smile.gif
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Ljubo44
post Nov 26 2011, 02:40
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How to convert audio file with nero recode 11. There is option for HD-AAC but its impossible to import audio files even wav. ?
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Sebastian Mares
post Nov 26 2011, 09:06
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Works only when encoding video files AFAIK. sad.gif

This post has been edited by Sebastian Mares: Nov 26 2011, 09:07


--------------------
http://listening-tests.hydrogenaudio.org/sebastian/
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darkbyte
post Nov 27 2011, 18:08
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I hope that the command line encoder gets updated for HD-AAC support in the near future.
menno: Can we get an estimate about this? We are eagerly waiting for it smile.gif

I guess foobar2000 and/or Winamp doesn't support HD-AAC out of the box so we have to wait for a decoder update there also.

I'm in the middle of a dillema to convert my collection of FLAC's into a hybrid format because i like to keep the lossless base but i'm also listening to a lots of music on my portable player where the lossless version is an overkill. And i don't like to organise the same files both in lossless and lossy format. There's actually three choices at the moment:

- WavPack: this works already, but the lossy filesizes are imo a bit too big for portable use (if i go with the recommended 384kbps setting). I've tried 256kbps but i can hear the added hiss what the lossy mode produces, mostly with electronic music. Maybe it could better if lossyWAV and WavPack gets integrated more tightly.

- mp3HD: you can do this already because there's a command line encoder in the Fraunhofer package. However it would be better to use LAME as the base mp3 encoder (better VBR quality), but i guess this'll never happen because the closed technical details. Also currently most of the players destroying the correction data on an ID3v2 tag rewrite which is sad. Even the format is not too fortunate because the correction part is stored in the tags so the upper limit is 256MB which is simply not enough for eg. an hour long continous mix. Also i don't know about a tool which can quickly copy the lossy part of the mp3HD file with the meta, skipping the correction part.

- HD-AAC: This seems to be the best choice. Lossy part can be high quality on relatively small bitrates (eg. Nero q0.5 @175kbps is fine in most situations) but i can keep the lossless version at once. I haven't found any SLS encoded file yet but i guess the SLS part gets stored in an additional MP4 track, so one can quickly remove it with mp4box using remuxing, keeping everything else. It's not even too hard to write a tool for this on my own.

HD-AAC would be my choice although there's no encoders and decoders out yet in the public sad.gif

This post has been edited by darkbyte: Nov 27 2011, 18:10
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lvqcl
post Nov 27 2011, 19:31
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QUOTE
I haven't found any SLS encoded file yet


Link here: http://wiki.multimedia.cx/index.php?title=MPEG-4_SLS
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darkbyte
post Nov 27 2011, 20:21
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QUOTE (lvqcl @ Nov 27 2011, 20:31) *
QUOTE
I haven't found any SLS encoded file yet


Link here: http://wiki.multimedia.cx/index.php?title=MPEG-4_SLS


Thanks! wink.gif

And i found the reference SLS encoder-decoder there, yipee! laugh.gif
I've tried to compile it with Visual C++ Express 2008, but i got a bunch of errors. Can somebody compile it into exe please? unsure.gif


Here's the output of MP4Box on a randomly picked SLS mp4:

CODE
c:\MP4Box>MP4Box.exe -info sls2100_aot02_048_16.mp4
* Movie Info *
        Timescale 48000 - Duration 00:00:48.575
        Fragmented File no - 2 track(s)
        File Brand mp42 - version 0
        Created: GMT Thu Oct 06 08:35:02 2011

File has no MPEG4 IOD/OD

Track # 1 Info - TrackID 1 - TimeScale 48000 - Duration 00:00:48.618
Track is present in Root OD
Media Info: Language "Undetermined" - Type "soun:mp4a" - 2279 samples
MPEG-4 Config: Audio Stream - ObjectTypeIndication 0x40
MPEG-4 Audio AAC LC - 2 Channel(s) - SampleRate 48000
Self-synchronized

Track # 2 Info - TrackID 2 - TimeScale 48000 - Duration 00:00:48.618
Track is present in Root OD
Media Info: Language "Undetermined" - Type "soun:m4ae" - 2279 samples
Audio Track - Sample Rate 48000 - 2 channel(s)
        Vendor code "...." - Version 0 - revision 0
        Codec configuration data size: 53 bytes


Looks like i was right about the secondary track smile.gif Although it doesn't know what the secondary track is, but i guess soun:m4ae is the SLS layer.

This post has been edited by darkbyte: Nov 27 2011, 20:58
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Ljubo44
post Nov 29 2011, 04:16
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I have problem with: libtsp.lib , in mpeg4sls/import folder

CODE
1>libtsp.lib(UTfree.obj) : error LNK2019: unresolved external symbol _errno referenced in function _UTfree
1>libtsp.lib(UTsysMsg.obj) : error LNK2001: unresolved external symbol _errno
1>libtsp.lib(UTerror.obj) : error LNK2001: unresolved external symbol _errno
1>libtsp.lib(AFtell.obj) : error LNK2001: unresolved external symbol _errno
1>..\..\dec.exe : fatal error LNK1120: 1 unresolved externals


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darkbyte
post Dec 10 2011, 17:49
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Any success since then Ljubo44? unsure.gif
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Ljubo44
post Mar 14 2012, 02:18
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This is hard for compiling, please heelp. any with enc.exe wacko.gif
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nu774
post Mar 14 2012, 09:37
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QUOTE (Ljubo44 @ Mar 14 2012, 10:18) *
This is hard for compiling, please heelp. any with enc.exe wacko.gif

As written in readme.txt, libtsp(in AFsp) and libisomedia is required.
Link for libtsp (in readme.txt) is dead, but you will be able to find it by googling it.
You have to build libtsp and libisomedia first, then copy the resulting libs to "import" directory.
The one in the directory is built with at least MSVC7.1 or older compiler using -ML switch (static, single-threaded runtime), which is no longer supported by newer MSVC compiler. Therefore, it is not usable due to runtime mismatch.
This way I succeeded to build this. However, the resulting executable (encoder) crashes.

It seems that libisomedia function MP4NewSampleDescriptionWithOCRAssociation() in ISOSampleDescriptions.c has a double-free bug, and it is the cause.
A pointer variable named esdAtom is also referenced from entry->ExtensionAtomList, and they try to destroy both of them.
I used the version in c052968_ISOIEC_14496-5_2001_Amd_10_2007_Cor_3_2009_Reference_Software.zip.

I googled it and found the similar report here:
http://lists.mpegif.org/pipermail/mp4-tech...ary/008672.html
You might be able to find fixed implementation somewhere, but I don't know.
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eahm
post Mar 14 2012, 10:11
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QUOTE (rpp3po @ Jan 11 2010, 11:28) *
Request this feature here (apple.com) if you want HD-AAC support in iTunes! Apple really pays much attention to customer feedback.

Way to many formats, thanks for the link, I am going to request FLAC support.

QUOTE (rpp3po @ Jan 11 2010, 12:34) *
FLAC has already convinced some bigger labels. And the little extra-scalability-feature won't turn the tide of the world just because they are Fraunhofer and had success once.

Completely agree.
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benski
post Mar 14 2012, 18:58
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QUOTE (darkbyte @ Nov 27 2011, 13:08) *
I guess foobar2000 and/or Winamp doesn't support HD-AAC out of the box so we have to wait for a decoder update there also.


HD-AAC would be my choice although there's no encoders and decoders out yet in the public sad.gif


Sorry, I've been busy working on some Winamp-for-Android stuff and havn't had time yet to get HD-AAC implemented.
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darkbyte
post Aug 5 2012, 23:24
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QUOTE (benski @ Mar 14 2012, 19:58) *
QUOTE (darkbyte @ Nov 27 2011, 13:08) *
I guess foobar2000 and/or Winamp doesn't support HD-AAC out of the box so we have to wait for a decoder update there also.


HD-AAC would be my choice although there's no encoders and decoders out yet in the public sad.gif


Sorry, I've been busy working on some Winamp-for-Android stuff and havn't had time yet to get HD-AAC implemented.


No problem. I gave up on my idea and moved to FLAC and use MP3/Vorbis for portable purposes (depending on the target player software/hardware). Although if a working HD-AAC encoder/decoder gets available i'll definietly give it a try.

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infoleather
post Aug 29 2012, 06:17
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These generated files to LC-AAC playback on any device playback?

This post has been edited by infoleather: Aug 29 2012, 06:17
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