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Topic: smartphones with good audio output (Read 17340 times) previous topic - next topic
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smartphones with good audio output

I have some questions about smartphones, their audio output, and their dacs.

1. What smartphones have the best quality audio output ? So far I've identified only iPhones and Galaxy S1, S3, and S4.

2. Why do smartphone makers develop so few models with sound quality as good as iphone 5 or galaxy s3, and so many models with lower sound quality than iphone 5 and s3 ?

3. How come only the most expensive smartphones have great audio quality, and dacs like wolfson and cirrus logic, and anything that's cheaper than the most expensive ones, do not get the same dacs and audio quality ? For example, some companies make a new flagship with 1080p display and one of the best audio quality output, and one of the best dacs. But they make a mini version of that flagship, with 720p display but not with the best audio output and dac. Many who buy the mini version, don't get the best audio quality.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #1 –
Quote from: codemaster on
1. What smartphones have the best quality audio output ? So far I've identified only iPhones and Galaxy S1, S3, and S4.


The iPhones are good, and some of the Galaxy S3/4 as well, but not all.  Samsung actually made several variants of each phone, some with good output and some with very bad.

More recently, most qualcomm devices tend to use the stock qualcomm output which is quite good.  Nvidia's tegra devices tend to use the Tegra output, which is quite bad.

Heres a table of output impedances I found on Google:

http://ko.goldenears.net/board/files/attac...87f5bfb2078.png

Obviously impedance isn't all, but lower indicates a higher quality amp generally.

Quote from: codemaster on
2. Why do smartphone makers develop so few models with sound quality as good as iphone 5 or galaxy s3, and so many models with lower sound quality than iphone 5 and s3 ?


They don't really know or care, and almost no one bothers to test this so they don't have any reason to. 

Quote from: codemaster on
3. How come only the most expensive smartphones have great audio quality, and dacs like wolfson and cirrus logic, and anything that's cheaper than the most expensive ones, do not get the same dacs and audio quality ?


I don't think this is true.  There doesn't seem to be any real pattern, other than that Apple always uses good stuff.  Cheap devices could be good or bad otherwise, expensive devices good or bad.  I don't think most companies even know what they're using, so its just random. 

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #2 –
Just a question: how much in the variability of sound quality is due to choice of DAC, and how much to the analogue circuitry (I seem to remember that an early iPod had a bit of a bass deficiency with some transducers, which was caused by an under-specified capacitor (?))?

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #3 –
Do a Google search for "smartphone audiophile" and you'll find some comparison tests run on a variety of phones. Consensus seems to be that iPhone 4S, with its Wolfson DAC, has the best sound. The iPhone 5 scored just behind it, but I haven't seen anything about the audio on the new 5S. I was hoping for a CL chip that would do up to 24/192, since they're cheaper and more common now than when the 5 came out, but none of the teardowns I've read have even mentioned audio.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #4 –
Quote from: jkauff on
Do a Google search for "smartphone audiophile" and you'll find some comparison tests run on a variety of phones.


Got a link?

Quote from: jkauff on
Consensus seems to be that iPhone 4S, with its Wolfson DAC, has the best sound.


I don't think the 4S (or any modern iphone) has a Wolfson DAC.  Generally though its best not to pay attention to who makes a DAC, all vendors sell both quality and budget parts.  If I see a reviewer talking about the vendor, its usually a good sign that they've no real experience with digital hardware.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #5 –
There are several links in the search results to various comparisons.

Teardowns of the various iPhones and iPods have revealed which models use Wolfson and which use Cirrus Logic. In fact, the Lightning-to-30-pin adapter for the iPhone 5 has a Wolfson DAC built in.

I think CL sells about 10 different low-power chipsets. Some have a sample rate of 48 (presumably the "budget" versions used in the iPhone) and some a rate of 96. Because Apple slaps their own part numbers on the chips, it's hard to tell which CL chips they're using.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #6 –
Seeing as this is HA I would like to see which link you believe supports the claims you have made about audio quality.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #7 –
Quote from: saratoga on
Seeing as this is HA I would like to see which link you believe supports the claims you have made about audio quality.

I haven't made any claims. I don't even use my phone for music. I was just reporting that others have done comparisons--I know nothing about the methodologies used or the validity of those comparisons.

And I don't need to be reminded about the HA TOS. I've been around here even longer than you have.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #8 –
Quote from: jkauff on
Quote from: saratoga on
Seeing as this is HA I would like to see which link you believe supports the claims you have made about audio quality.

I haven't made any claims.


Quote from: jkauff on
Consensus seems to be that iPhone 4S, with its Wolfson DAC, has the best sound. The iPhone 5 scored just behind it, but I haven't seen anything about the audio on the new 5S.


This is a claim about audio quality, so please provide the source so I can evaluate it.  It doesn't matter if you did the evaluation personally (and why should it?  we discuss 3rd party tests all the time), the idea here is to let other people understand and critique.  Thats not possible if you refuse to provide evidence. 

Quote from: jkauff on
And I don't need to be reminded about the HA TOS. I've been around here even longer than you have.


Perhaps you need a reminder:

http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....974#entry149481

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #9 –
No, I don't need a reminder, and I'm not going to post a page of Google search results. Look them up yourself if you're curious. As far as I'm concerned, this "discussion" is over.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #10 –
Why do I get the feeling these comparisons showing the claimed superiority you talk about don't actually exist?

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #11 –
I took the liberty to google for "smartphone audiophile" as suggested by jkauff and came up with a comparison (including measurements by the company AMS Acoustics of frequency responses and total harmonic distortions): http://www.engadget.com/2012/10/02/iphone-...ls-audio-tests/

This should help this discussion, though I can of course not guarantee this it the comparison jkauff referred to.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #12 –
Quote from: jkauff on
No, I don't need a reminder, and I'm not going to post a page of Google search results. Look them up yourself if you're curious. As far as I'm concerned, this "discussion" is over.


You could just have spent the 10 seconds it took to cut and paste the links you're referring to and actually added to the discussion instead of wasting time arguing.

smartphones with good audio output

Reply #14 –
The Engadget link is pretty useless since they do not say what load they're using (my guess is "none") and several of the devices are very obviously clipping.  If you get -25 db THD you'd think it would be a clue that you are doing something wrong!