Anti-jitter RAM buffer in DACs, Which have one ? |
Anti-jitter RAM buffer in DACs, Which have one ? |
Aug 3 2003, 10:00
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#1
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Moderator Group: Super Moderator Posts: 3934 Joined: 29-September 01 Member No.: 73 |
In, http://www.tc.umn.edu/~erick205/Papers/pap...html#principles we can read about RAM buffers :
QUOTE This process is referred to as timebase correction and as stated before, any quality piece of equipment will implement it. That has been the ritual answer to jitter concerns since I'm on the Internet. But... if "any quality piece of equipment will implement it", then some non-quality pieces of equipment don't implement it. My question is : which ones ? The statement "quality piece of equipment" is completely subjective and doesn't give any information. For my grandfather, a "quality" CD reader will be a portable radio-cassette-CD-speakers combo for 100 $ in the supermarket. The "non-quality" one will be the Fisher-Price toy for children from 3 to 7. For an audiophile friend, the "quality" CD player will be the 25,000 $ Wadia CD Transport+DAC, while any player under 1,500 $ is just worthless crap. So, do a 200 $ CD Player always have a RAM buffer ? Or is it not considered a quality piece of equipment ? What about a 300 $ CD Player from 1990 ? |
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Aug 14 2003, 09:25
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#2
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![]() Group: Members (Donating) Posts: 591 Joined: 11-February 03 From: UK Member No.: 4952 |
You're pointing out the exact reason why a two box transport/DAC combo has jitter problems: you can't afford buffer underruns, since even the most unmusical listener will hear that.
So, when an spdif link is used, DACs don't use their own free running clock; instead, they have a clock that can follow the transport's clock. This is an ugly process: the perfect square wave that the transport's clock may well have is lost in the long way to the DAC; there's non-ideal cabling, noise, intermodulation between data and clock signals, and lots more. The DAC then, is not following a perfect clock at all! So you see, 'in real life', buffer over/underruns are not a big problem. But precluding those problems causes this other problem. As to one box cd-players: the rate at which their transport reads is controlled by the same clock signal as the DA-rate. By principle, the fifo will always be filled then. The purpose of a fifo here, isn't in the first place to buffer reading speed variations, but to cope with the fact that bits don't all have the exact same length on the CD surface. |
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Pio2001 Anti-jitter RAM buffer in DACs Aug 3 2003, 10:00
Patsoe Since it's the cheapest thing, I can't ima... Aug 3 2003, 19:58
F1Sushi All CD players contain buffer memory between the E... Aug 3 2003, 21:13
Halcyon QUOTE As far as jitter at the DAC stage is concern... Aug 4 2003, 09:36
2Bdecided Pio,
I agree with the importance of your question... Aug 4 2003, 11:27
F1Sushi QUOTE (Pio2001 @ Aug 3 2003, 05:00 AM)So, do ... Aug 4 2003, 12:53
F1Sushi QUOTE (Halcyon @ Aug 4 2003, 04:36 AM)Does th... Aug 4 2003, 13:44
Patsoe Those are interesting side notes, F1Sushi.
Could ... Aug 4 2003, 14:05
F1Sushi QUOTE (Patsoe @ Aug 4 2003, 09:05 AM)Those ar... Aug 4 2003, 14:25
Patsoe QUOTE (F1Sushi @ Aug 4 2003, 02:25 PM)http://... Aug 4 2003, 14:44
Pio2001 Thanks, all of you for the answers.
There was a pa... Aug 4 2003, 14:54
F1Sushi QUOTE (Patsoe @ Aug 4 2003, 09:44 AM)QUOTE As... Aug 4 2003, 15:01
Pio2001 Sorry, I completely lost the link. It was an old s... Aug 4 2003, 21:13
F1Sushi QUOTE (Pio2001 @ Aug 4 2003, 04:13 PM)Sorry, ... Aug 4 2003, 21:21
Pio2001 No sorry, there was no color, it was all about jit... Aug 4 2003, 22:02
F1Sushi QUOTE (Pio2001 @ Aug 4 2003, 05:02 PM)No sorr... Aug 4 2003, 22:13
Halcyon F1Sushi,
thanks for the clarification!
More ... Aug 5 2003, 08:52
F1Sushi QUOTE (F1Sushi @ Aug 4 2003, 04:21 PM)QUOTE (... Aug 6 2003, 03:23
F1Sushi QUOTE (Patsoe @ Aug 4 2003, 09:05 AM)Those ar... Aug 6 2003, 04:10
Pio2001 QUOTE (F1Sushi @ Aug 6 2003, 05:23 AM)Could t... Aug 6 2003, 12:49
TrNSZ There is a device available from most high-end aud... Aug 6 2003, 13:24
F1Sushi QUOTE (TrNSZ @ Aug 6 2003, 08:24 AM)There is ... Aug 6 2003, 14:17
F1Sushi Found it - actually it's from Monarchy Audio, ... Aug 6 2003, 14:36
Patsoe Actually, from the description I'd suspect it ... Aug 6 2003, 15:22
F1Sushi QUOTE (Patsoe @ Aug 6 2003, 10:22 AM)Actually... Aug 6 2003, 15:34
TrNSZ To clarify on the "Monarchy Audio" DIP D... Aug 6 2003, 15:57
F1Sushi QUOTE (TrNSZ @ Aug 6 2003, 10:57 AM)To clarif... Aug 6 2003, 16:20
2Bdecided In the current (September!) issue of Hi-Fi New... Aug 6 2003, 16:32
F1Sushi QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Aug 6 2003, 11:32 AM)The o... Aug 6 2003, 16:42
Halcyon 2Bdecided,
do you know of studies/measurements an... Aug 6 2003, 19:25
F1Sushi QUOTE (Halcyon @ Aug 6 2003, 02:25 PM)However... Aug 6 2003, 19:44
Pio2001 You can always record an SPDIF output with an SB l... Aug 6 2003, 21:19
Patsoe QUOTE (F1Sushi @ Aug 6 2003, 03:34 PM)QUOTE (... Aug 7 2003, 08:30
F1Sushi My take on it is that the statement about "ab... Aug 7 2003, 12:46
Patsoe QUOTE (F1Sushi @ Aug 7 2003, 12:46 PM)Thought... Aug 7 2003, 15:23
2Bdecided QUOTE (Patsoe @ Aug 7 2003, 02:23 PM)QUOTE (F... Aug 7 2003, 15:36
F1Sushi QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Aug 7 2003, 10:36 AM)QUOTE... Aug 7 2003, 15:42
ChristianHJW This thread confirms a couple of opinions i have s... Aug 7 2003, 16:01
Patsoe QUOTE (ChristianHJW @ Aug 7 2003, 04:01 PM)..... Aug 7 2003, 18:56
Halcyon Shhh... don't tell them. It's reserved for... Aug 7 2003, 20:09
F1Sushi Just came across this link, which raises several t... Aug 7 2003, 20:42
2Bdecided This thread should be in the FAQ!
Cheers,
Dav... Aug 8 2003, 09:51
F1Sushi Here's a Monarchy Audio DIP on a chip:
http:/... Aug 8 2003, 16:36
d_kay303 QUOTE (ChristianHJW @ Aug 7 2003, 07:01 AM)Th... Aug 14 2003, 08:44
Pio2001 As 2Bdecided explained, this is only valid for che... Aug 14 2003, 12:17![]() ![]() |
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