Vorbis quality – wrong direction?, RC3 against post-final encoder Options

[harashin]

The Modest Tuning Beta2 won my own test. Apparently it's superior to other Vorbis encoders on this kind of sample. (sharp attack, symbal)
Although aoTuV b1 is also thinkable as a good choice for its reasonable bitrate.

[music_man_mpc]

However, it was not so good because the average bitrate of MTb2 is too high (around 160-170kbps).

Perhaps next time you could compare it to 1.01 -q5 as well? Results would be interesting, IMO.

[QuantumKnot]

It certainly is surprising that lossless coupling is doing so badly compared with uncoupled. Theoretically, you'd expect they should be the same!

[harashin]

It certainly is surprising that lossless coupling is doing so badly compared with uncoupled.  Theoretically, you'd expect they should be the same! 

Indeed, it's very odd. However, I was able to ABX between LC and UC with score at 15/20. Also, they don't actually seem to be same.

lc_uc.png

[QuantumKnot]

It certainly is surprising that lossless coupling is doing so badly compared with uncoupled.  Theoretically, you'd expect they should be the same! 

Indeed, it's very odd. However, I was able to ABX between LC and UC with score at 15/20. Also, they don't actually seem to be same.

lc_uc.png

Monty made a good point in IRC that this is to be expected since compilers do random things to FP computations

[guruboolez]

...One year later

Just for curiosity, I've tried another comparison, using the same samples, in order to check vorbis's progress during three years, and especially during the last one.
I kept vorbis RC3 (march 2002), vorbis 1.01 (march 2003), and add the most advanced vorbis encoder: aoTuV beta 3. I'd like to check the amount of noise/coarseness audible with aoTuV compared to an old encoder which wasn't too affected by this problem.

results:



ABX log/scores are here.

There are still audible issues with aoTuV at this bitrate, but they are much lower than vorbis RC3. One exception: the last sample, which RC3 performed differently (and to my ears: better) on brass (micro-attacks sample).
Bravo to Aoyumi!

This post has been edited by guruboolez: Dec 29 2005, 22:18

[DreamTactix291]

Wow. That is some nice improvement.

It looks like aoTuV is pushing Vorbis in the right direction instead of regressing it

[Aoyumi]

There are still audible issues with aoTuV at this bitrate, but they are much lower than vorbis RC3. One exception: the last sample, which RC3 performed differently (and to my ears: better) on brass (micro-attacks sample).

The handling of a micro attack is one of the big subjects truly.

I know that QuantumKnot is performing the trial for solving this problem.
Probably, I am looking forward to it.

This post has been edited by Aoyumi: Feb 16 2005, 15:09