foo_pod - Foobar2000 meets the iPod, iPod -> Foobar2000 0.8 Options

[drbeachboy]

Bugs and crashes are reasons to put components on the list of known problematic components, not unliked but completely legal behaviour. We will not label a component as problematic on such grounds.

So locking foobar2000 for an hour and a half while the same 2 second loop of music played, preventing me from cancelling the operation or even stopping playback so I could do something else with my soundcard while it operated is considered "legal behaviour"? If the plugin had actually done something useful after that time, I might even be able to agree. However, it returned a console literally full of error messages that I was unable to see and stop so I could fix the problem.

However, I suppose that'd be at best merely my opinion. Hmm.

I've been following this thread since it's inception, and I can say that I do not recall anybody having an hour and a half lockup with foo_pod. I've had quite a few lockups over the years with foobar2000, along with lots of other programs, as well. Sometimes you just have bite the bullet and press Alt-Ctrl-Delete. That's what it's there for, I think. ;-) Again, had you just stated the problem straight on, you may have been given an explanation as to what might be going on in your situation. I don't want to speak for Aero, but I think your problem would have been addressed had you used just a little bit of tact when you originally posted your problem. You seem to lose site of that fact. Aero made this plugin for free and out of the goodness of his heart. You shouldn't disrespect the one person that you are going to for help. Think about it?

Regards,
Dirk

This post has been edited by drbeachboy: Jun 26 2005, 21:43

[Mike Giacomelli]

Wow - that's a great story.  Thanks for sharing!  Hope you have better luck with something else.

Maybe you missed the point. In its current form, I'm personally pushing to have foo_pod added to the Problematic list. Components should never lock foobar2000 like foo_pod does, preventing cancellation, playback, and interaction with the main window for an extended period of time.

You mean like the file renamer does? Better add some of ZzZzZz's componets then . . .

[Canar]

You mean like the file renamer does?  Better add some of ZzZzZz's componets then . . .

File renamer displays a modal dialog with a progress meter and a cancel button. On top of that, it's never disrupted my music playback.

[drbeachboy]

You mean like the file renamer does?  Better add some of ZzZzZz's componets then . . .

File renamer displays a modal dialog with a progress meter and a cancel button. On top of that, it's never disrupted my music playback.

Yes, just as I have never experienced your problem! I guess each computer system is different, and programs encounter different kinds of problems on different kinds of systems.

[ReD-BaRoN]

I'm sure the iPod has some sort of internal limiter, to prevent the amplifer from being overdriven.

Yeah, something like that is going on, but songs without SoundCheck data get louder than I can get them with the preamp@100%+SoundCheck, I'm presuming this limiter has something to do with the numeric value in the volume variable.

You are adjusting the pre-amp setting for both SoundCheck and non-SoundCheck songs, right?

I'm actually only using the SoundCheck one, since all my songs I'm putting on the iPod have ReplayGain associated with them.

Semi-recent versions of foo_pod have separate settings for songs with and without SoundCheck, although I believe some iPod firmware versions ignore the volume/pre-amp setting when SoundCheck information is present (which is likely your problem).

Not sure about that, I'm using the latest version of firmware 3/23/05 for iPod photo (v1.1), and I do see that volume/pre-amp does have an effect on the songs with SoundCheck. For example, if I have the preamp at 100%, with an iPod slider volume at 50%, the song is louder than if the preamp was at 50%.

I suppose I could add some sort of SoundCheck bias setting, but you could also manually adjust the ReplayGain values on your songs and make them a little higher - say take a -6dB RG value and make it -3dB or 0dB.

Yeah I could do this, but an option in foo_pod would be nicer/cleaner. I'm willing to do it if you wouldn't mind sharing the source.

What I will probably do is remove the slider for RG pre-amp (since it doesn't always work, depending on the firmware version) and replace it with a Quieter/No change/Louder switch that would do what you are looking for.  I'll consider putting that in  the next version.

What I think would be best would be to actually keep the slider as a percentage slider, and take the Replaygain value and decrease the db reduction that is done. For example, if I have a Reaplygain value of -6dB, and a "boost" setting of 50%, then the resulting SoundCheck would be calculated based on a ReplayGain of -3dB. I know this is probably logorithm based, so the calculation would be slightly different, but you get the idea.

Thanks for listening Aero!

[Otto42]

The other problem I have had is that after a 'Sync All Playlists' you seem to keep a handle open to the "Ipod_Control/iTunes/Play Counts" file, which also renders the "Safely remove hardware" feature of Windows useless for ejecting the ipod until I close foobar2000.

This is a bug, but it can only occur if the Play Counts file is unreadable by foo_pod. Try deleting it and see if the problem persists.

Edit: Actually, before you delete it, send me the Play Counts file so I can figure out why foo_pod can't ready it.

It is zero bytes big.

Dunno if this matters, but there is a known issue bandied about on the Apple forums with regards to this stuff. The latest version of the firmware on 4G and up units can cause files to become inaccessible after the iPod reboots from a deep sleep mode (where you don't touch the thing for 36 hours or so). Running chkdsk on the iPod fixes the problem, until it goes back into deep sleep.

No word on when they're going to get a fix for this, but it's been around quite a while. The Play Counts file is particularly affected, because it is left open when you pause a song and set the iPod down, I think. Lots of people have the "Cannot read Play Counts" file message using iTunes and the latest firmware and newer iPod's.

[kl33per]

Offtopic: I hate that deep-sleep mode, it forgets that I hate the clicker.

[Otto42]

Deep Sleep mode isn't supposed to forget anything. It used to work fine, but they broke it in recent firmwares.

[FreydNot]

Deep Sleep mode isn't supposed to forget anything. It used to work fine, but they broke it in recent firmwares.

Any idea which version number I need to go back to for the bug to be "fixed" on my 4th gen?

[Otto42]

Not offhand. I think the latest firmware on those is something.2 and the one that isn't broken is something.1. Dunno if that helps.

[kl33per]

I think the latest firmware is 3.0.2. By Otto42's logic then, the working firmware should be 3.0.1. Going back to the previous firmware will probably re-introduce other bugs though.

Offtopic: On a completely different note, I'd like to say a big happy first birthday to foobar2000 0.8.3. It was compiled exactly one year ago from today, June 28th.

[reardon]

I think your last sentence could be slightly reworked:
"Its not going to be released until the beta is over in order to discourage developers from writing 3rd party plugins."

Aero, as always, thanks for foo_pod. It is the most valuable of all plugins for me, and combined with the solid and flexible foobar core has changed the way I use and organize music.

You ban from this forum, for an innocuous, accurate comment was hilarious and amateurish.

Thanks for continuing your work on the 0.8 version. I support your decision to not update for 0.9 even though I personally would benefit greatly from the add'l ID3v2 support. If whoever banned you would apologize for a ridiculous overreaction than I'd reconsider. For now, thanks for all your work. The only person involved in fb2k who deserves more praise, in my mind, is the creator himself.

Will be interesting to see how long this post survives. Aero if you provide your email@ to me via pm I will offer feedback that way, should the same dork who banned you ban me.

+Reardon

[Peter]

Aero's "ban" was a result of forum software bug, which changed 3-day removal of posting ability into infinite, which we fixed two weeks later when we noticed the problem. As you can see, no one is banned, or was banned to start with. Apparently Aero & friends have a lot of enjoyment from trolling board staff/regulars about that issue. We have been patient not to even give any further warnings despite of repeated TOS #7 violations, but this nonsense has to stop.
Next time someone brings this up, admin-level actions *will* be taken.

[Otto42]

I think the latest firmware is 3.0.2.  By Otto42's logic then, the working firmware should be 3.0.1.  Going back to the previous firmware will probably re-introduce other bugs though.

There's a new iPod firmware out for 4G and up units today. They might have fixed it in that release. Worth a shot anyway.

Although the new firmware might break foo_pod compatibility too. Keep your old firmware installer handy, just in case.

[Johnny Space Cad...]

I upgraded to the new firmware and am now getting this error when I load files via the contextual menu > send files to iPod:

WARNING (foo_pod) : Unable to parse Play Counts file 'g:\iPod_Control\iTunes\Play Counts' (error 13)


Oh, let me just say, THANK YOU Aero, Otto and everyone else who have contributed to this awesome plug-in!

[Aero]

There's a new iPod firmware out for 4G and up units today. They might have fixed it in that release. Worth a shot anyway.

Although the new firmware might break foo_pod compatibility too. Keep your old firmware installer handy, just in case.

There are some significant new changes in the databases created by iTunes 4.9 (Otto - how do *3* mhsd's strike you? ), and due to the changes, foo_pod can't currently read databases written by iTunes 4.9. I'll try to get foo_pod updated tonight, but foo_pod users might want to hold off on iTunes 4.9 and the latest firmware until I get foo_pod updated.

Edit: Wow, there is a lot of new, weird stuff in the new database format. There are show notes now, so you can associate some text with a song, and it is accessible by clicking the center button once you get back the time and stars screens. The most interesting new feature is that you can now have subsongs (like found in Cue sheets) in a single song. For example, I found an Apple new music podcast that was broken up into 7 different subsongs - the time progress bar is split up into 7 sections, and you access each subsong by pressing the next/back button. Pretty cool stuff, but it is going to take some work to update iPodDB to not crash on the new format (they added yet another string format and the subsong stuff is implemented as a MHOD (type 17)), let along be able to do anything useful with it.

This post has been edited by Aero: Jun 28 2005, 20:32

[Aero]

I upgraded to the new firmware and am now getting this error when I load files via the contextual menu > send files to iPod:

WARNING (foo_pod) : Unable to parse Play Counts file 'g:\iPod_Control\iTunes\Play Counts' (error 13)


Oh, let me just say, THANK YOU Aero, Otto and everyone else who have contributed to this awesome plug-in! 

Ooops...I should have posted a minute earlier. Yeah, so hold off on the updates for now until I figure out what is going on.

[Otto42]

Sonofa... Here I am trying to write a nice interface to my parsing libraries, and they go and change the damn thing on me.

Okay. Email me a copy of the new files, would you, Aero? I'd like to get some of this stuff documented if possible. Might just take the opportunity to rewrite the library entirely and make it cleaner and more robust.

[Roninr6]

well i screwed up and had installed itunes 4.9 and the new ipod installer, I wanted to check out the new podcast features.

So now I cant use foo_pod, how can i go back to the updater fron 03-23. the update option is greyed out. Would a restore from wothing the 03-23 updater help at all. I wouldnt think so.

So basically the podcast that aplle offers are a waste, and now i cant put my music on my pod with foobar.

How long until you think there might be an update to foo pod to work around apples changes?

[Aero]

well i screwed up and had installed itunes 4.9 and the new ipod installer, I wanted to check out the new podcast features.

So now I cant use foo_pod, how can i go back to the updater fron 03-23.  the update option is greyed out.  Would a restore from wothing the 03-23 updater help at all.  I wouldnt think so.

So basically the podcast that aplle offers are a waste, and now i cant put my music on my pod with foobar.

How long until you think there might be an update to foo pod to work around apples changes?

There are some pretty significant changes in the iTunes 4.9 database format - I assume at this point, every non-iTunes application is either completely broken or not writing out fully compliant databases. foo_pod is pretty close - I might have an update tomorrow.

To go back to a previous firmware version, go to your iPod's iPod_Control\Device directory and open up SysInfo in a text editor (like Notepad). Find these lines:

buildID: 0x04208000 (4.2)
visibleBuildID: 0x01208000 (1.2)

Change them to something like this:

buildID: 0x03208000 (3.2)
visibleBuildID: 0x00208000 (0.2)

Save the file and run the Updater again. Basically, you just need to convince the Updater than you have an earlier firmware version.

There are more details here.

[Roninr6]

There are some pretty significant changes in the iTunes 4.9 database format - I assume at this point, every non-iTunes application is either completely broken or not writing out fully compliant databases.  foo_pod is pretty close - I might have an update tomorrow.

To go back to a previous firmware version, go to your iPod's iPod_Control\Device directory and open up SysInfo in a text editor (like Notepad).  Find these lines:

buildID: 0x04208000 (4.2)
visibleBuildID: 0x01208000 (1.2)

Change them to something like this:

buildID: 0x03208000 (3.2)
visibleBuildID: 0x00208000 (0.2)

Save the file and run the Updater again.  Basically, you just need to convince the Updater than you have an earlier firmware version. 

There are more details here.

Thanks that worked a treat. Foo Pod is working like a charm again.


Thanks for the help, and thanks for this kickass plugin. you have made my life better since i dont have to use that crap they call iTunes

[Roninr6]

I am having a weird issue with foobar lately.

when i highlight a song (or a number of songs) and right click, there is a 5-7 second delay before the right click menu pops up.

I think it is relateted here because when i do the right click, iPodservice.exe jumps from usind 0% of CPU resources to close to 25%, then the milisecond it returns back to 0% the right click menu pops up.
Its really weird, it didnt use to do this until I started fecking with stff yesterday.

anyone have any suggestions

EDIT: It only happens when the iPod is not mounted, if the iPod is present then the right click has 0 delay.

This post has been edited by Roninr6: Jun 29 2005, 17:44

[kl33per]

iPodService is searching all the available drives to see if any of them are iPod's. Only seems to effect some people (it effects me to).

[Iuppiter]

even goPod doesn't work anymore with firmware 1.2 on iPod photo...
that's a pitty.

[Aero]

even goPod doesn't work anymore with firmware 1.2 on iPod photo...
that's a pitty.

Other than the Play Counts file, which was extended in the latest firmware and thus incompatable with previous software, just updating the firmware shouldn't break any 3rd party programs. It is the database changes introduced by iTunes 4.9 that cause the majority of the problems.