foo_pod - Foobar2000 meets the iPod, iPod -> Foobar2000 0.8 Options

[.zolder]

Hi I've got a 3g 40gb iPod and i've uploaded a bunch of albums to my iPod using foo_pod. I've uploaded 1 folder containing 30 albums, no problems. Then i uploaded another folder containing somewhat like 100 albums. Those albums now take up space, but the iPod doesnt seem to know that the files are there. They're not written in the DB file properly i suppose...
Is anyone familiar with this, and maybe got an idea on how this can be fixed, or is it a bug?

Thanx in advance

[scottder]

This may or may not be the thread to ask this, is anyone working on support Apples Lossless Encoder for foobar?

Scott

[Aero]

When I look at the tag of a file that has been "Soundchecked" by iTunes, this is what it says in the "comment" field:  00001020 0000118B 00003555 00004352 0002E675 0002230E 00008000 00008000 0001D4EE 0001D4EE

I thought that as you'd already figured out how to calculate Soundcheck values from Replaygain values, it would just be a matter of adding that into the "comment" field? Guess I was wrong then...

No, you are correct. The catch is that the "just be a matter of adding that into the "comment" field" part is the unknown piece here.

Actually now that I think of it, I think Otto42 determined that the first series of alphanumeric characters (00001020) is just the Sound Check value from the database. But the rest of the groups are apparently unknown, unless someone can point me to more recent information.

[Aero]

This may or may not be the thread to ask this, is anyone working on support Apples Lossless Encoder for foobar?

I would suggest asking in the Foobar 2000 General forum, or maybe one of the other Hydrogen Audio forums, such as AAC - General.

Since Foobar's MP4/AAC support is based off of FAAD, I would guess that FAAD would have to support ALAC before support could be added to Foobar/foo_pod. ALAC was discussed here, and one of the FAAD developers posted several times, so they are definitely aware of ALAC.

[Aero]

Hi I've got a 3g 40gb iPod and i've uploaded a bunch of albums to my iPod using foo_pod. I've uploaded 1 folder containing 30 albums, no problems. Then i uploaded another folder containing somewhat like 100 albums. Those albums now take up space, but the iPod doesnt seem to know that the files are there. They're not written in the DB file properly i suppose...
Is anyone familiar with this, and maybe got an idea on how this can be fixed, or is it a bug?

Yeah, that sounds like a bug, but without more detailed information or steps to reproduce the problem, I'm not sure how to help. At least for the past few versions, I haven't experienced any missing song problems like you describe, so I am interested in trying to find out what happened.

You could use the Components->foo_pod->Export iTunesDB as XML feature to save the database to a XML file, then search through it to see if your missing albums are there.

This post has been edited by Aero: May 17 2004, 20:53

[.zolder]

hmm more detailed specs: p3, W2k, Foobar 8.1, latest foo_pod, LAME --aps encoded files, Unicode ID3v2 tagged files. I hope this is enough. I dont see why there should be anything wrong with this setup... maybe foobar8.2?
I've had the problem with foo_pod 0.5 too, back when foobar 8.1 was the latest release (i think??)

edit: i've tried to upload one single album from that previously mentioned folder. It still doesnt work. the albumname is nothing fancy (D:\MP3's\ambient\liquid morphine - grijsgebied)

This post has been edited by .zolder: May 17 2004, 21:19

[Aero]

hmm more detailed specs: p3, W2k, Foobar 8.1, latest foo_pod, LAME --aps encoded files, Unicode ID3v2 tagged files. I hope this is enough. I dont see why there should be anything wrong with this setup... maybe foobar8.2?
I've had the problem with foo_pod 0.5 too, back when foobar 8.1 was the latest release (i think??)

edit: i've tried to upload one single album from that previously mentioned folder. It still doesnt work. the albumname is nothing fancy (D:\MP3's\ambient\liquid morphine - grijsgebied)

There is nothing wrong with your setup, but I was looking more for detailed steps to reproduce the problem. For example, how are you transferring files to the iPod - are you using Send Selected, Send Playlist, Sync Playlist, Send All Playlist, or Sync All Playlists? Can you delete all songs and playlists, then reproduce the problem? Do you get any warnings or errors in the Foobar console?

If you want, export your iTunesDB file as XML, zip it up, and email it to me (foopod (at) argz.com) and I'll see if there is anything pecular with it.

[.zolder]

haha okay, i misread!

- I removed ALL my music files + all manually made playlists (not the dynamic ones: top 25, recently played, blabla)
- I enqueued one single album containing 11 files
- I selected all and rightclicked > foo_pod: Send selected files to iPod
- I see the Transferring files... window, transferring complete, no error msgs
- I browse the iPod using explorer (diskmode?): the files are there
- I start iTunes: no files
- I unplug the iPod and browse it: no files

how do i export that DB file?

This post has been edited by .zolder: May 17 2004, 21:50

[Aero]

haha okay, i misread!

- I removed ALL my music files + all manually made playlists (not the dynamic ones: top 25, recently played, blabla)
- I enqueued one single album containing 11 files
- I selected all and rightclicked > foo_pod: Send selected files to iPod
- I see the Transferring files... window, transferring complete, no error msgs
- I browse the iPod using explorer (diskmode?): the files are there
- I start iTunes: no files
- I unplug the iPod and browse it: no files

how do i export that DB file?

Thanks, that looks like a very concise test case.

To export the database XML file, go to the Components menu, then foo_pod, then "Export iTunesDB Database as XML". foo_pod will then ask you where you want to save the file, save it as something like problem.xml. Then email me the problem.xml file and I'll see if there is anything in there that would point to the problem.

One potential problem that isn't related to foo_pod is how your cleaned your iPod. If you deleted the songs in iTunes, then that should be ok. If you just deleted songs off of the iPod using Windows Explorer, then the database was not updated and I would expect that there would be problems, since the iPod does not react well to songs that are in the database, but not on the iPod.

One last question - if you load the iPod playlist in Foobar (Component menu, foo_pod, Load iPod Songs to 'iPod (foo_pod)'), so you see the album you just transferred?

Edit: One other source of a potential problem - if you have iTunes set up to automatically sync when you start iTunes or connect your iPod, then it is likely removing the songs you transferred with foo_pod. The problem is that iTunes sees songs on the iPod that don't exist in its library, and deletes them from the iPod. So you might want to test that you can transfer files via foo_pod and verify that they are on the iPod before starting up iTunes.

This post has been edited by Aero: May 17 2004, 22:04

[Otto42]

When I look at the tag of a file that has been "Soundchecked" by iTunes, this is what it says in the "comment" field:  00001020 0000118B 00003555 00004352 0002E675 0002230E 00008000 00008000 0001D4EE 0001D4EE

I thought that as you'd already figured out how to calculate Soundcheck values from Replaygain values, it would just be a matter of adding that into the "comment" field? Guess I was wrong then...

No, you are correct. The catch is that the "just be a matter of adding that into the "comment" field" part is the unknown piece here.

Actually now that I think of it, I think Otto42 determined that the first series of alphanumeric characters (00001020) is just the Sound Check value from the database. But the rest of the groups are apparently unknown, unless someone can point me to more recent information.

That's correct, the first value in that big ugly comment string is the value that iTunes puts into the iTunesDB as the SoundCheck field. foo_pod is now putting a ReplayGain value in that field, since we worked out the conversion equation.

However, the rest of the stuff in that comment baffles me. I don't know what any of it means, and I can't find any obvious correspondence to anything anywhere. But if you figure it out, let us know.

[Otto42]

Aero,
I don't know if you do file extension checking in foo_pod or not, but be sure to add "M4B" as an acceptable file extension, if you haven't already. This is a bookmarkable AAC file, meaning that the iPod will remember where it left off when you stop and restart playing it. Handy for audio books. Yes, it works with unencrypted files as well, just rename m4a to m4b and voila.

This post has been edited by Otto42: May 18 2004, 00:42

[Aero]

Aero,
I don't know if you do file extension checking in foo_pod or not, but be sure to add "M4B" as an acceptable file extension, if you haven't already. This is a bookmarkable AAC file, meaning that the iPod will remember where it left off when you stop and restart playing it. Handy for audio books. Yes, it works with unencrypted files as well, just rename m4a to m4b and voila.

I don't explicitly do anything with file extensions, but it looks like Foobar's MP4 decoder does:

CODE

mp4_parser.cpp:
DECLARE_FILE_TYPE("MP4 files","*.MP4;*.M4A;*.M4P");

input_aac.cpp:
DECLARE_FILE_TYPE("AAC files","*.AAC");

So you might want to contact zZzZzZzZzZzZz and ask him to add *.M4B to that list.

[kl33per]

You can temporarily add it to the Nero Decoding Plugin's list, although it woud be better to add it to foobar itself.

[Aero]

Version 0.6.2 is now available.


This version adds the ability to copy files from the iPod to your hard drive, formatted according to a user-configurable standard Foobar TAGZ string.

In simpler terms, it means that you can select files on the iPods, select "Save iPod File to disk", and it will copy them to your local hard drive and arrange them according to the format you provide.

For example, the default format string is basically equivalent to %artist%\%album%\%tracknumber% - %title%, so after you provide the base directory, foo_pod will build the artist and album directories, and copy the iPod files to the correct locations. So the song The Thing That Should Not Let It Be (track number 05) by the group Beatallica off of the A Garage Dayz Nite album would be copied to Beatallica\A Garage Dayz Nite\05 - The Thing That Should Not Let It Be.mp3

I intend on making the preference for this a drop down box, so multiple formats can be chosen from. If you have a good TAGZ format string that you think others could use, email or PM it to me and I'll consider including it in the next foo_pod release.

In 0.6.2, I also fixed the context menu/iPod mount problem reported by Fickle.


From the Readme:

CODE

Version 0.6.2 - May 18, 2004
*  Added the "Save iPod Files To Disk" feature.  This allows you to copy songs from the iPod
  to your hard drive in a structured fashion, based on a user-configurable TAGZ format string.
  For example, the default string will copy files from the iPod to the hard drive in
  a <artist>\<album>\<tracknumber> - <title>.<extension> format -> Aerosmith\Honkin' On Bobo\11 - Stop Messin' Around.mp3
 
  To use this feature, select one or more files from the iPod playlist, right click and select
  "Save iPod files to disk".  Then select the starting directory for the files to be copied.
  The formatting is a standard TAGZ format string and can be modified in the preferences.

*  Changed the context menu code so that it will not automatically mount the iPod in order
  to just show the menu.

*  Eliminiated the limit of 30 ignored playlists.  The number of ignored playlists is now
  unlimited.

[.zolder]

Hi Aero,

You mentioned something about auto-updating. I let iTunes auto-update the playlists only, not the music files themselves. I thought this couldn't be the problem, but i tested whether this could be causing the problem anyway. Uploaded a random album with foo_tunes, undocked the iPod and the album was there. Then I deleted the album with iTunes, closed iTunes, uploaded it yet again with foo_tunes and started iTunes. The files were gone!

Problem solved

thanx

Cool! I really do like the freshly added option!

This post has been edited by .zolder: May 19 2004, 18:19

[Fickle]

This new feature rules Thanks Aero !

[Biscuits]

Great feature! Good to know for if I ever lose my music on my hard drive.

Thanks.

[Otto42]

I let iTunes auto-update the playlists only, not the music files themselves.

Not possible. If you have "auto-update" enabled in iTunes, then what it's doing is auto-updating the entire iPod from whatever parameters you have selected.

So if you have it set to "auto-update" from a playlist called "bob", for example, then what will happen when iTunes auto-updates is that every song in bob will get copied to the iPod, and every song on the iPod not in bob will be removed. Also, the playlist bob will be copied over to the iPod.

If you have it set for more than one playlist, then it works the same way.. Any songs in the playlist will get copied to the iPod, anything on the iPod not in any of those playlists gets blown away.

The only way to stop iTunes from blowing away music on the iPod is to put it into full manual mode. There is no other way to do it.

[ronyzyz1]

What currently happens when the iPod is out of space? I have tried to fill my 40GB 3G iPod with my 80GB library, and foo_pod did not say anything.

[Aero]

What currently happens when the iPod is out of space? I have tried to fill my 40GB 3G iPod with my 80GB library, and foo_pod did not say anything.

Theoretically, foo_pod should continue to try to copy files, display a warning on the Foobar console for each file that can't be copied, and everything should be ok.

However, I have noticed that sometimes there are problems related to running out of disk space, including problems writing the database. I have been meaning to try to reproduce and fix the problem(s), but I haven't gotten around to it. Besides, if I don't hear about a bug/problem on the forum or through email, I am less motivated to fix it!

[Lew_Zealand]

What currently happens when the iPod is out of space? I have tried to fill my 40GB 3G iPod with my 80GB library, and foo_pod did not say anything.

Theoretically, foo_pod should continue to try to copy files, display a warning on the Foobar console for each file that can't be copied, and everything should be ok.

However, I have noticed that sometimes there are problems related to running out of disk space, including problems writing the database. I have been meaning to try to reproduce and fix the problem(s), but I haven't gotten around to it. Besides, if I don't hear about a bug/problem on the forum or through email, I am less motivated to fix it!

Actually, I'm glad you mentioned this, Aero. I've been having problems with loading songs onto my 10GB iPod the last few days, but haven't had any time to examine the problem closely. I get an error message similar to "no space on device" and "restoring db" at the end of the errors.

I do know my iPod is not out of space, as I've removed all songs and playlists from it, both from foo_pod, and from iTunes (but not when both are running simultaneously, of course).

I can load songs/playlists from iTunes without problems, and have even gone as far as restoring the iPod with Apple's updater. Even after that, foo_pod reported there was no free space on my iPod.

I won't be able to do any testing until Saturday or Sunday, but I'm open to suggestions on how to acquire more data on this issue.

I hope this helps the motivation factor, becasue I'm going into replagain withdrawl!

[Aero]

Actually, I'm glad you mentioned this, Aero.  I've been having problems with loading songs onto my 10GB iPod the last few days, but haven't had any time to examine the problem closely.  I get an error message similar to "no space on device" and "restoring db" at the end of the errors.

I do know my iPod is not out of space, as I've removed all songs and playlists from it, both from foo_pod, and from iTunes (but not when both are running simultaneously, of course).

I can load songs/playlists from iTunes without problems, and have even gone as far as restoring the iPod with Apple's updater.  Even after that, foo_pod reported there was no free space on my iPod.

I'm pretty close to posting the next foo_pod version, which reserves 10MB of disk space to prevent weird problems due to filling up all of the free disk space. I believe iTunes actually reserves 20MB, and I don't think anyone will be too put out over losing 2-3 songs worth of space.

As for your problem, I don't know why foo_pod would be reporting that the iPod is out of space if it actually isn't. I know I've never experienced a problem similar to that. If you can reproduce the problem, post or email the exact Foobar console output. Also try the upcoming 0.6.3 version to see if it is any better.

[Aero]

Version 0.6.3 is now available.

This adds a combo box for the "Save iPod Files To Disk" feature, so you can easily switch between different formats. It also has the 10MB reserve space feature that I mentioned above, to hopefully take care of out-of-disk space problems.


From the Readme:

CODE

Version 0.6.3 - May 22, 2004
*  "Save iPod Files To Disk" formats are now displayed in a combo box, allowing the user to
  add and choose between multiple format strings.

*  foo_pod now reserves 10MB of disk space when copying files to the iPod.  This should help
  avoid problems when attempting to copy more files than there is free iPod disk space.

*  Built using Foobar2000 SDK 0.8.2.

[neomoe]

hey there!

thank you for that wonderful plugin! i love it!
the only thing i need now is a playcount withwhat you can create smart-playlists so u can replace itunes completely.

[Lew_Zealand]

Actually, I'm glad you mentioned this, Aero.  I've been having problems with loading songs onto my 10GB iPod the last few days...

I figured it out. I've been forcing foo_pod to use a specific drive letter, and for some reason another firewire device is not being detected by my machine (I may have accidentally ejected it). So foo_pod was looking for my iPod as drive K:, when it was actually drive J:


All is well now. Thanks for all the great work you've done on foo_pod.