Upcoming Iron Maiden album will not be mastered, NO COMPRESSION. Will sound exactly as it did in the studio! Options

[Woodinville]

Does anyone aside from me find it absolutely ironic that of all bands, Iron Maiden is the one doing this?



N.B. That is not to say I dislike them. I'm saying that of all bands to finally lose it with the "make it louder" race ...

[BradPDX]

Having recorded and produced several CDs of various types of pop (rock, folk, country, etc.) I have a hard time believeing that this is actually a very good idea.

While I do agree that much modern pop music is excessively compressed, this is hardly a reason to ditch all that "mastering" entails. There are so many reasons for this, where to begin?

1. Live music happens on a different scale than playback allows
A real metal band (OK, not my favorite type of music but it illustrates the point) plays at pretty darn high levels, which is a large part of the "charm" as it were. They are also playing in some location that is larger than your bedroom. They are also delivering energy into the air via a multitude of means: mics, drums directly into the space, guitar/bass amps, etc.

At home, you are listening at a much smaller scale, and this changes EVERYTHING about the perception of the music. Part of the reason for mastering (and compression) is to provide a musical experience on the appropriate scale so that listeners don't have to blast the doors off to get the message.

2. Recorded music is often "unperformable"
How many times have I overdubbed guitar parts? Thousands. Maybe the first pass is acoustic rhythm, then another, then some electric fills, then half the solo on a mandolin and the other half on a Telecaster. All of these things are loads of fun to do, but the truth is that a) I can't play all those parts at once b) the volume levels of these instruments are wildly different c) the dynamics of these instruments are wildly different

Without quite a bit of studio trickery, these parts simply wouldn't mesh at all. Our modern ears have become accustomed to these "unnatural" combinations of instruments, but in truth they can only coexist with a lot of help from very unnatural sources - like compression.

3. Older recordings use compression, too!
While there may be a rash of "irrational exhuberance" regarding the modern use of heavy compression, compressors have been a stable of recording studios since the 1950's. All those Beatles records - compression and EQ tricks abound. Stephen Still's acoustic guitar work with CSNY - compressed to death to give it a "sound". The list goes on and on, but the upshot is that dynamics compression has been a fundamental part of recorded pop for a long, long time.

Flame shields up: Metal is often quite compressed by the very nature of instruments used. Distorted guitar is by definition heavily compressed in a way that has clearly pleased players and audiences for decades, which is part of the charm of an overdriven amp/guitar combination. Metal players push the distortion way up, resulting in even less natural dynamic range.

Compare this with, say, bluegrass - all acoustic, meant to be played and heard a a low level, with lots of transients and natural dynamics in the stringed instruments. The nature of this music makes it impossible to play very loud, and thus the use of compression has a different meaning. In practice, one must apply some compression because the dynamics of the instruments are quite extreme - otherwise, listeners will have to play the music at live levels to hear it well. Fortunately, I probably can play a bluegrass CD at "live levels" without having the police visit my house.

I believe that some mastering and compression can greatly benefit the delivery of music to real-world playback systems, when done properly. To ditch it completely is throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

[Maurits]

[..]

I believe that some mastering and compression can greatly benefit the delivery of music to real-world playback systems, when done properly. To ditch it completely is throwing out the baby with the bathwater.

Couldn't agree with you more. The band will know this too and if they don't they'll find out as soon as they try to play some 'rough' edits at other places than the studio.

What I think they actually mean is that the album will not be compressed to death like so many modern CD's are, not that there will be no mastering or compression at all.

[molnart]

Does anyone aside from me find it absolutely ironic that of all bands, Iron Maiden is the one doing this?
N.B. That is not to say I dislike them. I'm saying that of all bands to finally lose it with the "make it louder" race ...

I'm not sure their move has something to do with the "loudness race". Maybe they just want the CD sound more faithful to the original, or deliver a "dirtier" sound....

[Hollunder]

What I read there means that there just won't be any mastering, which doesn't imply that there will be no compression at all, they'll just do everything in the mixing stage.
Maiden won't record in a bad studio so I guess you won't hear too much difference to a 'mastered' album.

[niktheblak]

Does anyone aside from me find it absolutely ironic that of all bands, Iron Maiden is the one doing this?

I don't really understand you. Iron Maiden albums of the 80's and early 90's were very "silent" (RG values around 0) and very dynamic indeed, as were other recordings of that era. Maiden really started overcompressing their albums pretty late, in the 00's.

For live performances, well, that's a different story. But I know that Metallica, Manowar and possibly Spinal Tap have always been louder

Flame shields up: Metal is often quite compressed by the very nature of instruments used. Distorted guitar is by definition heavily compressed in a way that has clearly pleased players and audiences for decades, which is part of the charm of an overdriven amp/guitar combination. Metal players push the distortion way up, resulting in even less natural dynamic range.

True. I once made a metal recording that, much to my astonishment, had a flat dynamics profile before I had even gotten a chance to mess with the dynamics! That's RG value of -9 with just plain normalizing!

You are of course right. Distorted electric guitar has basically zero dynamic range. But what makes dynamics in metal is, of course, drums. A standard drumkit has a huge dynamic range, I would imagine around 0-120 dB. How much dynamics is apparent in a metal recording is largely dicated by how loud the guitar track is mixed and how loud the drummer beats the drums.

Most 80's metal recordings by bands such as Iron Maiden, Metallica and Slayer exhibit considerable dynamic range because the drums are given a lot of space to breathe. Nowadays the guitar is mixed so that it's about the same level as the peak levels of the drums, so that the dynamic range of drums is limited to the upper couple of decibels.

Also, even more sadly, the de facto standard of today is to use a trigger with drums, that is, replacing actual drum hits by a sample from a drum machine. This allows for zero variance in dynamic range between consecutive drum hits and it basically reduces the drummer to a mere metronome. This is by far the worst thing ever happened to music (at least to metal) and I religiously refuse to use triggers whenever I get the change.

[iGold]

For mp3 VBR (~210 kbps) replaygain Album Gain = -6.73 dB, Album Peak = 1.059981. Much better then Dance of Death with -10.10 dB and 1.243614 (for ogg q3).

[Funkstar De Luxe]

No mastering? This is either a lie or the worst idea I've heard in a long time. There's a very good reason that record companies spend thousands upon thousands of dollars mastering record, and it's not just to make them loud. Good mastering will wean out any problems occurring in the mix and ensure it is 'listenable' on a varied amount of playback systems. Non electronic records require a great deal of mastering before sounding pleasing.

[evereux]

Does anyone aside from me find it absolutely ironic that of all bands, Iron Maiden is the one doing this?

I don't really understand you. Iron Maiden albums of the 80's and early 90's were very "silent" (RG values around 0) and very dynamic indeed, as were other recordings of that era. Maiden really started overcompressing their albums pretty late, in the 00's.

The Number Of The Beast (1982) = -4.12 dB
Piece Of Mind (1983) = -4.20 dB
Powerslave (1984) = -3.46 dB
Live After Death (1985) = -2.86 dB
Somewhere In Time (1986) = 3.18 dB
Seventh Son Of A Seventh Son (1988) = -2.13 dB
No Prayer For The Dying (1990) = -4.70 dB

Not quite around 0 here. These are pretty much all the original UK releases I have.

[iGold]

Hmm, the sound of latest/hotest album is really... "raw" may say. But I can't say "bad", just a bit unordinary.

[de Mon]

Iron Maiden - A Matter of Life and Death
RG = -6.71 dB

[hellokeith]

OK, I'll set this whole thread straight.

1. There is obviously a difference between the "mastering" they speak of not having, and downmixing which is of course required to get 2 channel 44.1kHz 16 bit CD Audio out of the many individual studio tracks.
2. Last few Maiden albums, the band has recorded some tracks live as a whole unit.
3. The only thing satanic here is the mere mention of drum triggers, which are from the devil (or perhaps invented by Sony).
4. PowerSlave is the all time best metal album ever, so of course is the first Maiden album one should purchase. After that, Brave New World, Somewhere in Time, Dance of Death, & Piece of Mind would give you all the different (and good) types of music that Maiden can create.

/thread

[Anacondo]

I have the album, and it sounds *really* good. Album replaygain is around -6dB. Finally a heavy metal album with dynamics!

PD: if you like Maiden, get this, you won't be dissapointed

[Lyx]

3. The only thing satanic here is the mere mention of drum triggers, which are from the devil (or perhaps invented by Sony).

What is the difference between the two? ;-)

- Lyx

[Synthetic Soul]

OT posts removed. Lyx's can stay to show I'm not totally devoid of humour.

Please continue on topic.

[RockFan]

Iron Maiden have announced that their new upcoming album titled "A Matter of Life and Death" will not be mastered in any way. This means that there will be no processing done-best of all NO COMPRESSION.

I hope more and more artists realize the futility of engaging in the "Loudness Race" and start producing some good sounding CDs. As for me, I am ecstatic!!!

UPDATE: You can check out the music video of their first single here. Well, this is a streamed video and the sound might be encoded at very low bitrates, however, I love the way it sounds. You can hear Bruce's amazing voice clearly and I swear Nicko's drums never sounded better on any of their previous albums. If this video is an indication of the sound quality of the upcoming album, I can safely say that we finally have a GREAT sounding Iron Maiden album!

What the guys are trying to do, in effect, is emulate the 'direct to disc' vinyl that has occasionally been used for all kinds of music - classical, rock, jazz.

I remember back in the early 80's, "Warsaw Pakt" cut a session direct to laquer (an EP, IIRC) on a Saturday, the disc was pressed over night and into Sunday, and was in the shops by Monday.

edit>> it was actually an entire album, and it was in 1977. The quote below isn't quite correct - the sessions were defintely cut 'direct to disc', not recorded or 'mastered'.

The album “Needle Time” was recorded for Island in November 1977 and was indeed recorded, mastered, produced, packaged and distributed within a 24-hour timeslot, from 10 p.m. on Sat 26 November to 7 p.m. on Sunday 27 November – the band were trying to make a point about the way technology, etc. had opened up the potential for music to be truly immediate.

This post has been edited by RockFan: Aug 30 2006, 17:16