WAV as a container for lossless codecs?, Would this make lossless compression more transparent? |
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WAV as a container for lossless codecs?, Would this make lossless compression more transparent? |
 Sep 19 2006, 19:10
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#1
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Group: Members Posts: 149 Joined: 20-July 03 Member No.: 7881  |
Well, the subject/description mostly says it all.
Im slightly fuzzy on the windows .wav format, however Im pretty sure that essentially it is a container format, like AVI is. As such, Ive seen .wav's containing mp3's, Ive heard of .wav containing DTS (?) etc. - Can the same be done with a lossless format? (wavpack flac, monkey, I dont care) - If it can be done, is my assumption true that most windows programs that use the standard windows interface to read the WAV file can suddenly use the lossless compression driver to dynamically read/write such data? Or would doing this be a big waste of time? |
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Sep 19 2006, 19:39
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#2
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Group: Super Moderator Posts: 4793 Joined: 1-April 04 Member No.: 13167 |
Wave is a container for PCM data and nothing else.
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Sep 19 2006, 19:56
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#3
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 dBpowerAMP developer Group: Developer (Donating) Posts: 2208 Joined: 24-March 02 Member No.: 1615 |
Wave can have many formats, not just PCM - ADPCM, even mp3 can be embeded within wave files. There is one restriction, vbr is a no-no so your lossless codec would have to be a cbr encoder.
This post has been edited by spoon: Sep 19 2006, 19:57 -------------------- Spoon http://www.dbpoweramp.com
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Sep 19 2006, 20:00
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#4
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Group: Members Posts: 208 Joined: 12-March 04 From: Germany Member No.: 12686 |
nonsense deleted
This post has been edited by pest: Sep 19 2006, 20:01 |
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Sep 19 2006, 20:37
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#5
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Group: Super Moderator Posts: 4793 Joined: 1-April 04 Member No.: 13167 |
Here's an interesting link:
http://www.borg.com/~jglatt/tech/wave.htm |
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Sep 19 2006, 20:44
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#6
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 Group: Members Posts: 111 Joined: 2-December 05 From: Netherlands Member No.: 26157 |
QUOTE (greynol @ Sep 19 2006, 20:39)  Wave is a container for PCM data and nothing else. WAV can hold PCM and compressed data such as GSM audio, mp3 etc. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/WAV |
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Sep 19 2006, 20:48
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#7
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Group: Super Moderator Posts: 4793 Joined: 1-April 04 Member No.: 13167 |
QUOTE (Kef @ Sep 19 2006, 12:44) WAV can hold PCM and compressed data such as GSM audio, mp3 etc. spoon beat you to it, but I got the message loud and clear. |
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 Sep 19 2006, 20:53
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#8
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Group: Members Posts: 111 Joined: 2-December 05 From: Netherlands Member No.: 26157 |
QUOTE (puntloos @ Sep 19 2006, 20:10) Well, the subject/description mostly says it all. Im slightly fuzzy on the windows .wav format, however Im pretty sure that essentially it is a container format, like AVI is. As such, Ive seen .wav's containing mp3's, Ive heard of .wav containing DTS (?) etc. - Can the same be done with a lossless format? (wavpack flac, monkey, I dont care) - If it can be done, is my assumption true that most windows programs that use the standard windows interface to read the WAV file can suddenly use the lossless compression driver to dynamically read/write such data? Or would doing this be a big waste of time? I'd vote, big waste of time. AFAIK in order to use compressed audio in the wav container you need something called ACM (Audio Compression Module) in your windows/system32/ folder. I don't think there are any FLAC.acm or moneky.acm's available. Anyway, it's more trouble than it's worth. Better stick to whatever you are using now. QUOTE (greynol @ Sep 19 2006, 21:48) QUOTE (Kef @ Sep 19 2006, 12:44) WAV can hold PCM and compressed data such as GSM audio, mp3 etc. spoon beat you to it, but I got the message loud and clear. Oops, I don't know how I missed his post. Sorry... |
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Sep 19 2006, 20:59
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#9
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dBpowerAMP developer Group: Developer (Donating) Posts: 2208 Joined: 24-March 02 Member No.: 1615 |
To tell you the truth I don't rate that article, some of the chunk headers are in the wrong case, and he mentions LIST chunks and goes on about 3 sub chunks within LIST and misses out the main INFO chunk (infact he says to ignore any LIST sub-chunk that is not labl, note, ltxt...hmmmm
Also he goes on about 'brain dead programmers' who embedd many different compressed types in waves - Microsoft has a standard list of the compressed formats (there are about 300), and with the right ACM codecs installed it works very well. I suppose if the guy is writing from the side of supporting wave files on anything that is non-Windows then these other wave_formats might be an inconvience. Not mentioning Wave format extensible dates it somewhat. -------------------- Spoon http://www.dbpoweramp.com
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Sep 19 2006, 21:18
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#10
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Group: Super Moderator Posts: 4793 Joined: 1-April 04 Member No.: 13167 |
He certainly wasn't afraid to tell you what he thinks, that's for sure.
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Sep 19 2006, 21:50
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#11
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Group: Members Posts: 309 Joined: 24-August 05 Member No.: 24095 |
QUOTE (spoon @ Sep 19 2006, 20:56) Wave can have many formats, not just PCM - ADPCM, even mp3 can be embeded within wave files. There is one restriction, vbr is a no-no so your lossless codec would have to be a cbr encoder. I hope you know this rules out any lossless codec that actually does any compressing... well, seeing that I almost daily use software you wrote, I REALLY hope that 
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Sep 19 2006, 22:01
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#12
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FLAC Developer Group: Developer Posts: 1487 Joined: 27-February 02 Member No.: 1408 |
there was at least one FLAC ACM floating around
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....showtopic=16048 the only use I see in it is getting FLAC to work in some legacy software that you can't update/change. Josh |
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Lo-Fi Version | Time is now: 22nd November 2009 - 03:41 |
