Most 'true' way to de-emphasize CD image, Remove pre-emphasis - possible and best ways? |
Most 'true' way to de-emphasize CD image, Remove pre-emphasis - possible and best ways? |
Aug 2 2008, 13:46
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#1
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Group: Members Posts: 7 Joined: 2-August 08 Member No.: 56600 |
Hello!
Have a question related to de-emphasizing of images of audio CDs mastered with pre-emphasis. What I've already found on this topic: 1. Using Waves Q10 plugin. But it seems to me that equalizer plugin is not the best way to achieve originally mastered sound. 2. Using foobar2000 convolver with Waves_De-Emphasis pulses. Don't know anythig good/bad for this way. So does anybody knows what way is 'true' to de-emphasize wave file? PS: I know that using EAC or K3b to burn CD and delegate de-emphasizing to CD player will solve issue. But for some reasons I need to have images on my PC and ability to play them or several tracks on players that don't support 'pre' flag. |
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Feb 24 2010, 12:51
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#2
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Group: Members Posts: 3080 Joined: 1-September 05 From: SE Pennsylvania Member No.: 24233 |
ANY operation on the data other than scaling by exactly a power of two will fill all 24 bits.
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Feb 24 2010, 19:42
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#3
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![]() Group: Members Posts: 1466 Joined: 30-November 06 Member No.: 38207 |
ANY operation on the data other than scaling by exactly a power of two will fill all 24 bits. But a parametric EQ shouldn't make it that much harder to compress? Or? -------------------- geocities.com/hydrogenaudio: http://goo.gl/tqYZj
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Feb 24 2010, 20:48
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#4
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Group: Members Posts: 2114 Joined: 24-August 07 From: Silicon Valley Member No.: 46454 |
ANY operation on the data other than scaling by exactly a power of two will fill all 24 bits. But a parametric EQ shouldn't make it that much harder to compress? Or? If you keep it at 16-bits, then it's no harder to compress. If you upsample to 24 bits without processing, it's no harder to compress. If you go to 24 bits and do any processing, then yes... As pdq said the extra bits are "filled up". You are working with integer files, and when you go from 16 to 24 bits, the additional bits are analogous to digits to the right of the decimal point. The extra bits are not used to make your file "louder", they are used to give you more "detail". (That's not strictly true... 24 bit audio is also used to get more headroom.) Your data is integer form, but your scale factors are not... So, when you apply a mathematical operation to your 16-bit integer, you need more precision, or you can round-off. For example, if you increase a sample value by 1dB, that's a scale factor of ~1.12202. With integer data that's going to require rounding. You will get more precision (less rounding error) with 24 bits. And, the higher precision means it's "harder" to compress. This post has been edited by DVDdoug: Feb 24 2010, 20:52 |
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EvilMax Most 'true' way to de-emphasize CD image Aug 2 2008, 13:46
pdq Are they still making CDs with pre-emphasis, or ar... Aug 2 2008, 14:46
EvilMax QUOTE (pdq @ Aug 2 2008, 16:46) Are they ... Aug 2 2008, 15:38

M QUOTE (EvilMax @ Aug 2 2008, 10:38) Egor,... Aug 2 2008, 15:51


EvilMax QUOTE (M @ Aug 2 2008, 17:51) QUOTE (Evil... Aug 2 2008, 16:22

Egor QUOTE (EvilMax @ Aug 2 2008, 21:38) Egor,... Aug 2 2008, 19:08

EvilMax It is all very interesting, thank you for informat... Aug 2 2008, 19:32

Egor QUOTE (EvilMax @ Aug 3 2008, 01:32) Inter... Aug 2 2008, 19:41

EvilMax QUOTE (Egor @ Aug 2 2008, 21:41) QUOTE (E... Aug 2 2008, 20:04
Porcus QUOTE (pdq @ Aug 2 2008, 14:46) Are they ... Feb 24 2010, 08:05
Porcus QUOTE (Porcus @ Feb 24 2010, 09:05) QUOTE... Apr 29 2012, 16:28
Egor You can de-emphasize using sox (a command line pro... Aug 2 2008, 15:17
sbooth CD de-emphasis was originally designed to be done ... Aug 2 2008, 16:37
Porcus QUOTE (sbooth @ Aug 2 2008, 16:37) If you... Feb 24 2010, 08:15
Surfi Using Waves Q10 too. Tried Sox before but did hear... Aug 2 2008, 16:57
greynol QUOTE (Surfi @ Aug 2 2008, 08:57) Using W... Aug 2 2008, 18:47
Surfi QUOTE (greynol @ Aug 2 2008, 19:47) How i... Aug 3 2008, 16:17
bandpass QUOTE (Surfi @ Aug 3 2008, 15:17) Either ... Aug 8 2008, 18:55
markanini QUOTE (bandpass @ Aug 8 2008, 18:55) QUOT... Aug 10 2008, 02:58
Surfi QUOTE (markanini @ Aug 10 2008, 03:58) th... Aug 10 2008, 11:00
benski Yes, de-emphasis is meant to be done in the analog... Aug 2 2008, 18:38
Glenn Gundlach QUOTE (benski @ Aug 2 2008, 09:38) Yes, d... Aug 2 2008, 19:00
M According to the changelog, the deemphasis filter ... Aug 2 2008, 20:03
Sebastian Mares Did anyone check how well iTunes deemphasizes CDs? Aug 3 2008, 11:08
markanini I have tried Sox and WaveEmph and comparing the sp... Aug 3 2008, 12:02
tot sox with --plot option and deemph will plot the fi... Aug 3 2008, 15:40
Aquares Tested with Denon Audio Technical CD (1984), Track... Nov 13 2009, 20:15
Wombat Never saw someone offering such measurements, than... Nov 14 2009, 02:19
Kees de Visser QUOTE (Wombat @ Nov 14 2009, 02:19) even ... Nov 14 2009, 15:29
Aquares QUOTE (Wombat @ Nov 14 2009, 03:19) One t... Nov 15 2009, 22:07
krabapple Measured difference of 0.2 dB is not bloody likely... Nov 15 2009, 06:07
Kees de Visser QUOTE (krabapple @ Nov 15 2009, 06:07) Me... Nov 15 2009, 12:19
Wombat I tried one more thing.
Seems really like the cre... Nov 16 2009, 17:23
pdq It should make little difference to a lossy encode... Feb 24 2010, 20:27
greynol So long as sox does the internal math at a higher ... Feb 24 2010, 20:57
Porcus @ DVDdoug and pdq:
The argument on the number of ... Feb 24 2010, 21:34
greynol QUOTE (Porcus @ Feb 24 2010, 12:34) Well ... Feb 24 2010, 21:48
pdq QUOTE (Porcus @ Feb 24 2010, 16:34) @ DVD... Feb 24 2010, 21:50

Porcus QUOTE (pdq @ Feb 24 2010, 21:50) Besides,... Feb 24 2010, 22:16
googlebot QUOTE (Porcus @ Feb 24 2010, 22:34) @ DVD... Oct 26 2010, 09:58
knutinh QUOTE (googlebot @ Oct 26 2010, 10:58) Th... Oct 26 2010, 12:14
googlebot As said, it's already all in post #36.
Digit... Oct 26 2010, 13:45
knutinh QUOTE (googlebot @ Oct 26 2010, 14:45) As... Oct 26 2010, 14:25
googlebot QUOTE (knutinh @ Oct 26 2010, 15:25) This... Oct 26 2010, 15:08
Porcus QUOTE (googlebot @ Oct 26 2010, 16:08) QU... Oct 27 2010, 10:14
googlebot QUOTE (Porcus @ Oct 27 2010, 11:14) (Are ... Oct 27 2010, 11:04
2Bdecided QUOTE (googlebot @ Oct 27 2010, 11:04) Ro... Oct 27 2010, 15:35
googlebot QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Oct 27 2010, 16:35) go... Oct 27 2010, 17:33
Wombat For the ones that want a VST solution to do some d... Oct 11 2010, 16:56
Wombat Well, not the most interesting thing but i wanted ... Oct 26 2010, 01:57
knutinh Now we are getting somewhere. So I should have sta... Oct 26 2010, 16:08
2Bdecided I think it's far simpler than you think.
Cons... Oct 26 2010, 16:42
knutinh QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Oct 26 2010, 17:42) 2.... Oct 26 2010, 18:32
2Bdecided Yes, but the design is such that it works "be... Oct 27 2010, 10:19
knutinh I guess that whatever per-channel correlation is i... Oct 27 2010, 12:38
googlebot Why exactly 8? Oct 27 2010, 12:42
knutinh QUOTE (googlebot @ Oct 27 2010, 13:42) Wh... Oct 27 2010, 15:42
Porcus QUOTE (knutinh @ Oct 27 2010, 16:42) QUOT... Oct 27 2010, 20:33
Porcus FWIW, I checked this with multiple lossless encode... Oct 28 2010, 01:09
Porcus For reference:
7 761 846 272 bytes: flac -8 (24 b... Oct 28 2010, 01:17
Bullit I haven't found much info on emphasis. From wh... Oct 28 2010, 03:45
Porcus QUOTE (Bullit @ Oct 28 2010, 04:45) I hav... Oct 28 2010, 10:05
Bullit QUOTE (Porcus @ Oct 28 2010, 10:05) QUOTE... Nov 1 2010, 04:09
Glenn Gundlach QUOTE (Bullit @ Oct 31 2010, 19:09) QUOTE... Nov 1 2010, 05:18
greynol Have you tried our wiki? It's generally the f... Nov 1 2010, 05:10
Bullit QUOTE (greynol @ Nov 1 2010, 05:10) Have ... Nov 1 2010, 19:22
lvqcl [misread] Nov 1 2010, 19:36
greynol QUOTE (Bullit @ Nov 1 2010, 11:22) I look... Nov 1 2010, 19:43![]() ![]() |
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