Big-label mastering engineers don’t understand lossy formats, Article about Mastered for iTunes |
Big-label mastering engineers don’t understand lossy formats, Article about Mastered for iTunes |
Mar 27 2012, 09:12
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#1
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![]() Group: Super Moderator Posts: 790 Joined: 12-March 05 From: Kiel, Germany Member No.: 20561 |
Just found this article via twitter, circled among mastering "engineers" (in fact Heba Kadry reposted it, the girl who mastered the latest Mars Volta album, which reaches -12.79 dB on my RG scans, and is generally mastered in a horrible fashion).
This further backs my impression that most of them don't have a single clue of what they are doing. The section about the mastering practices of Rubin and Meller are especially eye-opening to me. Masterdisk "engineers" also apparently are now out to rape the Rush back catalogue. Further down they cite phase-reverse tests to prove AAC files are different from the original (wow, REALLY?). The good thing is, I can use this article to decide which releases to avoid in the future. But I'm really at a loss what we can do beside that. I'm really fed up with mastering "engineers" destroying music releases. This post has been edited by Kohlrabi: Mar 27 2012, 09:17 -------------------- Audiophiles live in constant fear of jitter.
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Apr 5 2012, 21:56
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#2
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![]() Group: Members Posts: 110 Joined: 6-June 10 From: Bavaria Member No.: 81240 |
Don't know about that, but I was just browsing a thread over @ SH that lists about a gazillion* high-DR albums:
http://www.stevehoffman.tv/forums/showthread.php?t=243688 *) rough approximation They do listen to the listeners -- for example, convening listening panels to compare potential singles. The problem is that they don't level match, so whatever is louder tends to get rated better. THAT is why we have the loudness wars in the first place. Not level matching essentially boils down to neglecting that people have something called a volume control. One would think that they'd noticed that at some point? Or did nobody ever take the time to think about things like these (which would be sad, but not unlikely)? Then again, even if they had, who likes to admit that they've been wrong... This post has been edited by stephan_g: Apr 5 2012, 22:05 |
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Apr 6 2012, 02:01
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#3
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![]() Group: Members Posts: 477 Joined: 22-December 03 From: Malmö, Sweden Member No.: 10615 |
Not level matching essentially boils down to neglecting that people have something called a volume control. One would think that they'd noticed that at some point? Or did nobody ever take the time to think about things like these (which would be sad, but not unlikely)? Then again, even if they had, who likes to admit that they've been wrong... Interesting point stephan_g, maybe someone should conduct volume-matched blind tests with this in mind. Even better if this could happen where the conclusions would reach lots of people say on the Mythbusters show. The material should be prepared by the same people that work for the big labels, only that in the mastering stage there's one moderate master and one loud master made. For example 9:30-11.20 in this Bob Katz video http://youtu.be/u9Fb3rWNWDA?t=9m30s BTW I listenented to Noctourniquet and liked it, I'd even deem the production values as great overall but I'm hearing lots of pumping and some harshness in the loud parts. I'll go along with the harshness as an aesthetic choice but the pumping just sounds like crap. As an amateur producer I recognize it as a secondary effect of heavy hard limiting, you could achieve similar effects with a saturation effect without the pumping. As for Rick Rubins false statements sadly it seem it takes a certain kind of assertive person beside talent to have the priveledge of working with major label bands like TMV RHCP, The Strokes etc. This post has been edited by markanini: Apr 6 2012, 02:06 |
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Kohlrabi Big-label mastering engineers don’t understand lossy formats Mar 27 2012, 09:12
evereux QUOTE Apple’s 256 kbps AAC files are supposed to s... Mar 27 2012, 09:26
skamp They obviously think what they do is teh shit. Nor... Mar 27 2012, 09:32
2Bdecided I think you're being a little harsh on the art... Mar 27 2012, 09:35
Kohlrabi QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Mar 27 2012, 10:35) I ... Mar 27 2012, 09:44
Nessuno QUOTE (Kohlrabi @ Mar 27 2012, 09:44) Jus... Mar 27 2012, 10:55

DonP QUOTE (Nessuno @ Mar 27 2012, 05:55) QUOT... Mar 27 2012, 12:38
dhromed QUOTE (Kohlrabi @ Mar 27 2012, 09:44) I... Mar 27 2012, 14:10
Fandango @greynol: Oh, here it is explained by a guy named ... Mar 29 2012, 05:14
skamp QUOTE (Fandango @ Mar 29 2012, 06:14) PS:... Mar 31 2012, 10:59
KMD Thats round the wrong way, the article said the ... Mar 27 2012, 10:14
Arnold B. Krueger QUOTE (KMD @ Mar 27 2012, 05:14) Thats r... Mar 27 2012, 17:15
Porcus I bet the people behind Monkey's Audio will wa... Mar 27 2012, 11:15
RobWansbeck Vlado Meller is reported as saying :
“ The high... Mar 27 2012, 16:11
greynol http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....st... Mar 27 2012, 16:14
TrustScience QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Mar 27 2012, 03:35) I ... Mar 28 2012, 23:39
Canar QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 28 2012, 15:39)... Mar 29 2012, 03:12

TrustScience QUOTE (Canar @ Mar 28 2012, 21:12) QUOTE ... Mar 29 2012, 14:24

greynol QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 06:24)... Mar 29 2012, 15:22


krabapple QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 29 2012, 10:22) So t... Mar 29 2012, 17:14



greynol QUOTE (krabapple @ Mar 29 2012, 09:14) Yo... Mar 29 2012, 18:03


TrustScience QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 29 2012, 09:22) Your... Mar 29 2012, 17:18


greynol QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 09:18)... Mar 29 2012, 17:39


TrustScience QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 29 2012, 11:39) QUOT... Mar 29 2012, 17:49


saratoga QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 12:49)... Mar 29 2012, 18:02

greynol QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 06:24)... Mar 29 2012, 15:37


krabapple QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 29 2012, 10:37) QUOT... Mar 29 2012, 17:17


TrustScience QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 29 2012, 09:37) QUOT... Mar 29 2012, 17:32



saratoga QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 12:32)... Mar 29 2012, 18:00



2Bdecided QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 16:32)... Mar 29 2012, 18:26



TrustScience QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Mar 29 2012, 12:26) QU... Mar 29 2012, 18:52



Canar QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 10:52)... Mar 29 2012, 18:58




TrustScience QUOTE (Canar @ Mar 29 2012, 12:58) QUOTE ... Mar 29 2012, 19:02




greynol QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 09:32)... Mar 29 2012, 19:04




Canar QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 10:52)... Mar 29 2012, 19:04



saratoga QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 13:52)... Mar 29 2012, 19:37



2Bdecided QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 17:52)... Mar 30 2012, 10:19



TrustScience QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Mar 30 2012, 04:19) It... Mar 30 2012, 17:19



saratoga QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 30 2012, 12:19)... Mar 30 2012, 19:06




TrustScience That's true. I did make a couple clarifying ed... Mar 30 2012, 20:13



2Bdecided QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 30 2012, 17:19)... Mar 31 2012, 10:33



krabapple QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 30 2012, 12:19)... Mar 31 2012, 21:59


saratoga QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 29 2012, 10:37) QUOT... Mar 29 2012, 18:19

2Bdecided QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 13:24)... Mar 29 2012, 16:45

krabapple QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 09:24)... Mar 29 2012, 17:10

saratoga QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 09:24)... Mar 29 2012, 17:48

TrustScience QUOTE (saratoga @ Mar 29 2012, 11:48) The... Mar 29 2012, 18:02

saratoga QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 29 2012, 13:02)... Mar 29 2012, 18:13
saratoga QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 28 2012, 18:39)... Mar 29 2012, 04:29

greynol QUOTE the Mastered for iTunes process uses a healt... Mar 29 2012, 04:46
Fandango QUOTE (Canar @ Mar 29 2012, 04:12) QUOTE ... Mar 29 2012, 04:34
IgorC QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 28 2012, 19:39)... Apr 6 2012, 23:17
greynol I read the paper by Apple back when we first discu... Mar 29 2012, 05:23
Fandango Ah, it has been discussed before and Apple actuall... Mar 29 2012, 05:30
greynol I provided a link already. Go to the first post i... Mar 29 2012, 05:35
Fandango QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 29 2012, 06:35) I pr... Mar 29 2012, 05:51
saratoga I think the most damning thing about the mastered ... Mar 29 2012, 05:53
Fandango QUOTE (saratoga @ Mar 29 2012, 06:53) Ess... Mar 29 2012, 06:04
greynol As I said in the dedicated discussion, Apple is ad... Mar 29 2012, 05:59
saratoga QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 29 2012, 00:59) As I... Mar 29 2012, 06:12
greynol RE: Big-label mastering engineers don’t understand lossy formats Mar 29 2012, 06:30
2Bdecided It's what happens when the art-world and scien... Mar 29 2012, 09:36
drewfx Perhaps interviewing someone with a background in ... Mar 29 2012, 19:02
greynol When I am in a position to improve something of mi... Mar 30 2012, 16:49
TrustScience QUOTE (greynol @ Mar 30 2012, 10:49) When... Mar 30 2012, 17:40
saratoga QUOTE (TrustScience @ Mar 30 2012, 12:40)... Mar 30 2012, 19:13
greynol I'll try not to make this a long post as I... Mar 30 2012, 20:47
saratoga At least from my point of view (and as I mentioned... Mar 30 2012, 21:41
db1989 QUOTE (saratoga @ Mar 30 2012, 21:41) And... Mar 30 2012, 21:53
saratoga QUOTE (db1989 @ Mar 30 2012, 16:53) QUOTE... Mar 30 2012, 22:23
greynol Aside from db1989's point in the next post whi... Mar 30 2012, 21:52
greynol Since others are piling on while admittedly not ad... Mar 31 2012, 22:14
Axon Perhaps TrustScience would have found our reaction... Apr 1 2012, 17:26
Kohlrabi QUOTE (Axon @ Apr 1 2012, 18:26) In that ... Apr 1 2012, 18:09
knutinh QUOTE (Kohlrabi @ Apr 1 2012, 19:09) Warr... Apr 1 2012, 22:06
Kohlrabi QUOTE (knutinh @ Apr 1 2012, 23:06) QUOTE... Apr 1 2012, 22:22
knutinh QUOTE (Kohlrabi @ Apr 1 2012, 23:22) My p... Apr 2 2012, 09:00
skamp QUOTE (knutinh @ Apr 2 2012, 10:00) let u... Apr 2 2012, 09:15
knutinh QUOTE (skamp @ Apr 2 2012, 10:15) iTunes ... Apr 2 2012, 12:31
krabapple It's possible that calling famous mastering en... Apr 2 2012, 07:17
Kohlrabi The notion that mastering engineers who deliberate... Apr 2 2012, 13:07
db1989 QUOTE (Kohlrabi @ Apr 2 2012, 13:07) I al... Apr 2 2012, 13:25
Kohlrabi Thank you very much, db1989. That was what I had i... Apr 2 2012, 13:48
db1989 Great! Apr 2 2012, 13:50
absinthe33 QUOTE (Kohlrabi @ Mar 27 2012, 10:12) Jus... Apr 2 2012, 15:22
dhromed QUOTE (absinthe33 @ Apr 2 2012, 15:22) br... Apr 2 2012, 16:08
absinthe33 QUOTE (dhromed @ Apr 2 2012, 17:08) QUOTE... Apr 2 2012, 23:04
splice QUOTE (absinthe33 @ Apr 2 2012, 15:04) ..... Apr 2 2012, 23:52
2Bdecided Some lossy codecs can introduce audible temporal s... Apr 2 2012, 15:28
skamp Heba Kadry again: "While Im all for setting a... Apr 4 2012, 15:23
Kohlrabi QUOTE (skamp @ Apr 4 2012, 16:23) Heba Ka... Apr 4 2012, 22:29
splice QUOTE (Kohlrabi @ Apr 4 2012, 14:29) ... ... Apr 5 2012, 01:33
2Bdecided ...which leads back to Justin's latest article... Apr 4 2012, 16:25
2Bdecided QUOTE (2Bdecided @ Apr 4 2012, 16:25) ...... Apr 5 2012, 11:24
stephan_g ^Agreed. A "decent stereo", btw, include... Apr 5 2012, 16:30
krabapple QUOTE (stephan_g @ Apr 5 2012, 11:30) Why... Apr 5 2012, 18:04
2Bdecided QUOTE (stephan_g @ Apr 5 2012, 16:30) ^Ag... Apr 5 2012, 18:43
krabapple QUOTE (stephan_g @ Apr 5 2012, 16:56) Not... Apr 6 2012, 20:28![]() ![]() |
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