Hi everybody.

As you can see, I'm in Portugal and here we have compulsory military service for young males between 18 and 35 years old, though, in practice, most University students (exceptions are medicine and some engineering students, but only sometimes) are put in "territorial reserve" (not very well translated, I guess) and don't really do it. This is about to change in 2004 and the plan is to make military service optional, in a way to completely professionalize the army (which is the right way, imo). I know that some countries like Israel and Switzerland have different legislation, much "stricter" than ours and that others have already professionalized their armies completely...

How is it in your country and what do you think about this...?

cya

edit: typo

I had to register when I was 18. That was 1980. Not sure if it's still req'd. I don't anticipate registering for anything of that magnitude again other than when I arrive at the gates of hell. But it probably won't be necessary since they're expecting me.

xen-uno

In the US, registration is mandatory at age 18, but service in the miltary is completely voluntary.

The registration is just a safegard in the event that Canada invades and we need to re-institute the draft

There is no compulsary service here in Canada, although I did 2 years of service. As a nation Canadians are pretty peace loving people who would rather send "Peace-Keepers" all over the world. Not to mention that the defence budget is pretty low so our military couldn't probably support a compulsary enlisting of people. So in this way it has a perfossional army but in truth we have to defend our shore's from hostile Portugues fishing boats more than from other countries military

What do I think about this: I'm glad that there is no compulsary service although I do think it might be good to offer/require courses for things such as first aid/primary care, disaster relief, fire supression skills. These types of skills could be useful since there are often natuaral disasters (snowstorms, earthquakes)/ manmade problems (forest fires, oil spills) where some basic training in how to deal with these is always good. I don't think it is necessary that everyone has to know how to operate weapons or fix tanks.

PS - Indybrett - we will be invading you as soon as we find the key to our tank!

i wont go to the army although i would have to here in germany after school
you can also do some "social year" at your local church for example driving young children to their camping holidays and drinking beer all the time. pretty easy and better than that army shit
in some years they wont money anyway for the army and you can chose freely if you go there or not

It is still required...but I think it is important to say that it is only required or even allowed, if you are a male. This country still has a problem with sending its girls off to war along with the boys.

But then again, I'm sure we could spark up a big debate on whether females should be in combat situations or drafted etc.

In Denmark you are called for a medical examination at the age of 18. If you are considered healthy enough you are drafted; but can get lucky and be one of the few that are released of duty if the year group is too large. But in Denmark too many fail the medical examination these years because of degrading health standard among young people...they are too fat and weak so if you pass the medical examination you are in general drafted.

You can however declare yourself a conscientious objector and then you have to do community service instead.


Personally I consider the Danish "military" (called a defence in Denmark) a big joke...they have it in case Denmark should ever get in to a war; which is unthinkable in the first place. But if it ever happened the drafted military would be a big joke that could do nothing. we would rely exclusively on help from other counties.
I think the draf should be removed completely and only the professional military preserved.


And to the point about women's draft. IMO they should have to do some kind of community service if men has to.
Why should there be any difference?

No National Service (as it used to be called) here. Just professional forces plus what's known as the 'Territorial Army' which is essentially a voluntary reserve.

In France, the compulsory military service was removed in 2001, and the army is now professional. There are still two or three compulsory days, where, I've heard, the army is presented, and they ask if people want to join the army.

I Mexico the reasoning is pretty much the same as in Denmark, at age 18 you are required to do military service and you are not allowed to leave the country. The original reasoning was that in the unlikely event that Guatemala should invade us, we could make them laugh to death by our "highly trained and professional army".
Up to the year before I turned 18 this was the procedure. Everybody registered and only those who were fit went to training. The year I turned 18 nobody was drafted (in fact, nobody did anything) but I still was not allowed to leave the country (I had to ask for special permission). The next year, they debuted the "new system" which is what is done nowadays: because our army is pretty much a joke (it's only real use is in natural disasters and in to guard some events) the instituted mandatory community service, mainly alphabetization and re-foresting.
The BS factor is that only males do, which I find sexist and retrograde.

In the U.S., every male has to signup to "Selective Service" when they turn 18. Basically it is a list the government could use if they ever had to restart the draft (we became a professional army in the 70s I think). If we don't signup for selective service, we lose any chance of getting stuff like federal student loans from the government as well as other things I am sure. We don't have to do any training, just sign on a dotted line saying that we "agree" to be drafted if there ever was a need to. Ever since we went to a professional army we have never had a draft, although 1 or 2 congressmen got caught up in the 9/11 emotions and tried to get a movement to start the draft again to fight the terrorists. Thankfully didn't happen.

I don't mind Selective Service, I realize that freedom has to be defended and that in the future you never know what will happen that could require a draft. I just hope it isn't another Bush love affair with imaginary WMD war that causes it.

The thing to keep in mind, not singing up for the Selective Service is technically a crime.

According to http://www.sss.gov (Selective Service System)

What is the penalty for not registering?
If you do not register, you could be prosecuted and fined up to $250,000 and/or be put in jail for up to five years. Registration is also a requirement to qualify for Federal student aid, job training benefits, and most Federal employment.

Also mentioned on the site...

Not qualifying for federal education aid (as mentioned by chrisgeleven), federal jobs (one of the largest employers in the nation)in the Executive Branch and the U.S. Postal Service (thank Strom Thurmond for this), federal job training (otherwise known as workforce investment), naturalization (gaining citizenship), and some states apply additional penalties such as Oklahoma and Texas (the two states I'm most familiar with) which make it a condition of gaining a drivers' license or state ID.

military service is compulsory for all males here, and you have to do 2 or 2.5 years depending on the rank you attain. those not as fit would be placed in service or administrative vocations.

where i come from, israel, military service is compulsory

when you turn 18 you must go to the military. what you're gonna do in the military depends on where they need people and based on your so-called "profile". men do 3 years, women do 2 years. after that you can choose to stay with the army and make a career there or go and continue to study and get a job or whatever, but you are considered a reservist and must do military service until you are 55

if you're an arab-israeli or orthodox jew, AFAIK you don't have to enlist in the army. the ultra-orthodox jews will not serve, citing they are students of the torah or whatever. they vulonteer, though, to different services. the arab israelis, they only know how to enjoy the benefits of democracy and equal social status given to them in israel. of course, this is not to say arabs don't serve or are not allowed to serve in the israeli army. they just don't have to, and many don't. there are a few that do, and some have went to become high-ranking generals

Come on, man! We were all being so civil here...

Yeah, I was wondering about that too. So I asked a couple of women why they don't have to do military service and they told me this:
Because we born your children!

Belgium went to a fully professional army a few years before I would have been drafted.

Unfortunately, due to an administrative mistake, I also have the Italian nationality and Italy drafted me. (The draft was abandoned there too a few years later, but too late for me). I am currently avoiding military service there by 'studying outside the country', which is rather funny considering I've lived in Belgium for whole my life and don't speak a word Italian. If I would want to go to Italy, I need to go to a consulate and get special permission.

Ciao..


here in norway.. army service is compulsory.
you get registered/medical checkup and then drafted
in the 18`th year.. for many years it was 18 months. service..
then for about ten years ago.. levelled down to 16.
now.. it`s maybe down to 12.. (not shure..
it was discussed..)

you can refuse doing military service.. after writing a huge
*report*.. there you try to explain why not..

then if you application is accepted.. you get *drafted to
one of two camps.. in norway.. (depends where you live)
(imagine what we are called..)
where the funniest part.. is to get beat up..
by the locals.))
if you on another hand.. deny any type of service..
you get jail or community service.

womans can choose.

either way you look at it..
this processing.. puts norway on
the *illegal* list of amnesty`s
human rights violations.

In Germany the compulsory military service won't last many years. During the cold war in the 70' it lasted two years. Now the government is reducing it every now and then in order to prepare for a professional army like France has. Another point indicating the abolishion of this compulsary crap is that people who are T3 "gemustert" do no longer have to serve their country. Before one has to start the civil or military service you are checked medically. T1 means you are in best condition and T6 means you can be happy about each dawn you are able to face. As I'm T2 I have drive handicaped people during 10 months for the Red Cross.

As my father is French I had to take part in one compulsory day. There I had to see what the French army does and so on. As there is only a professional army in France (damn military service... ) this day was all I was obliged to do.

From Singapore here. Currently serving my national service of 2.5 years with a rank of 3rd Sergeant (3 strips).

Will be done in year 2004 then it's on the reserve list till i'm age 40. All in all, 13 years of in camp training to go after 2004. In a year, the gov can recall you back for a max no. of 40 days.

For a country with a population of 4 million we have a standing combine force of 50,000 soldiers & is able to recall in 16 hours the full army, navy & air force including those on the reserve list of a total strength of 350,000.

Sigh...

Here in greece military service is compulsory and it's 12 months now. I did 18 months

In Brazil military service is compulsory for men reaching 18. But because of the limited budget, most men are put in reserve (like me) and don't actually do it, otherwise the military wouldn't have enough money to feed the men three times a day... I'm real, this is not a joke.

The end result is that, in practice, only who really want to serve does it. Because our military is a joke, nobody really wants to do it except some guys who don't study and are unemployed, and really need the money (I'm generalizing here, of course). The service is paid, I think US$ 100 a month.

Well, I think that's fair because other countries in South America are in the same situation, or worse. If Argentina attacks us, we have numeric supperiority, at least. In a country with huge social problems like Brazil, the money is better spent in things other than the military. (Actually it ends in politicians pockets, but that's another story.)

I think this may be the most "international" thread I have seen on HA. Kinda cool, actually.

Agreed. I enjoy learning more about other countries. *sigh* It's just other languages I seem to have no aptitude for.

In my country it used to be compulsory for males (above 18 i think). You also were supposed to register.
In 1999 a new government came and things changed. Now is voluntary, but you are still supposed to register.

What happened if you didn't registered? I don't know, but it seemed that basically nothing happened. In the compulsory days, a friend once told me that if the military were doing a check and they caught you without being registered, they would take you inmediately in. There used to be 2, 3 or 4 (i think) periods of about two weeks (per year) where they used to go to the streets and check everyone passing near them, taking everyone they seemed fit (registered or not, whatever). Also if you by mistake went to register in one of these periods, you would also get caught. There were stories of people escaping before the bus could reach the army's site, and things like people running from the check points were common. Also bribery and pulling string influence (sons of politicians, etc) could be left alone. Some would simply attempt to fail the psychological tests or such. Supposedly sons with no brothers or sisters could be excempt too, but i think it didn't work much... The periods when this happened were usually at random, and by word of mouth an alert would go from person to person, to be ready and watch out for the "green buses", and most males would simply remain indoors in these weeks skipping classes, or work, if they could.

Once "enlisted", you were supposed to serve like 3 years. It usually meant going to the borders, our friendly neighbor Colombia has a nice history of guerrilla, drug dealers, and other armed groups many times trying (or succesfully passing) our borders, which means there have been constant skirmishes and killings. So you may be wondering why people would rather escape before it was "too late"... Of course in the past the pay was really bad too.

But today it is voluntary, more "professional", they have a little better salary and they have study options, to finish high school or begin a career (can be military if they qualify). Apparantly you can now also voluntarily "spend" your "service period" not only in the army, but in some social related services.

Our country is 24million people, but its relatively big. I didn't even knew that such a small country like Singapore had an army at all (i have a friend living there) But Israel is a whole other matter. I don't know how or when peace will be achieved in that region, but i think something radical like palestinians and israeli people marrying each other and forming mixed families or things like that need to be done over there. Its an endless bloodshed, and it saddens me, but BOTH sides need to stop and repent, especially to the eyes of God they always mention but seem to forgot...

Anyway in my opinion joining the Army should be voluntary and professional, unless there is a real emergency threat, but even then, how can you force people to kill others against their will? Many people won't simply do it because of religious beliefs, and how can any country deny their right to choose not to kill others or do/help in actions that could result in the killing of others?. Besides, volunteers would have a lot better morale than recruited by force people.

i am being civil
it's not like i'm lying

It is too bad that both sides have all that bloodshed going on. There is one thing certain, when war and religion are mixed the results are not pretty no matter who's God you claim to be following. Nothing is scarier then wars based on religion, except maybe wars between two totally different forms of government (Cold War between USA vs. USSR). Thing about religious wars is they pretty much never end, each side is try to get revenge for what the other side has done, even revenge for events thousands of years old.

Only way I can see it stopping is if both sides stop retaliating, even if there is an occassional suicide bomber or Israeli airstrike. It is like trying to figure out which kid started a fight, all they can do is point fingers at each other and say they were acting in self-defense.

Whoever can solve this conflict gets the Nobel Peace Prize for the next millenium, that is pretty much how huge such an achievement will be.

The conflict between Israel and Palestine will never end. Israel stakes a native, sovereign claim to the strip of land it is occupying now...and the Palestinian militants have pledged their whole lives (and lives) to driving the Israelis from that land, which they also claim is their birthplace. I think it shouldn't be a surprise that wherever the Israelis go as a nation, there will be some form of systematic opposition, violent or otherwise, to their existence.
Both sides of the conflict have offered themselves so little options to peace, I'm not surprised if the conflict never ends, or if some 'false peace' is brokered.

That was some discourse.

Anyway, I'm from Singapore too, and at this point I'm half a year away from being drafted.
Heheh, Singapore needs a defence force because of its geographical location and political and economic affiliations (Having close ties to the USA and all).

With such a small country, it's definitely a necessity to have compulsory military service. You're not going to have much of a defense force based solely on professional or even volunteer army...

Just professional army here in Spain. No military service anymore.

Afaik we've never had compulsory service here in Australia, we have had drafts though, during the vietnam war and possibly the second world war as well.

I'm a little surprised to hear of so many countries still with military service, it does make sense for some though.

Our military is basically focused around defending Australia which seems to be a bit easier when your an island nation, no land borders.

Sweden too has "compulsory" service. It's in quotes because if you don't want to it's easy enough to be placed in the reserve and get away with only the two days of physical examination. I was blind according to their tests so I got away quite easily

And you should always eat yellow snow - it could be beer!

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