split from this topic


Roberto, I wish you would stop spreading this. I don't think you're speaking from a position of authority in this case. Practically all the feedback I get from developers, except Peter, is just the opposite. As a matter of fact, most of the implementations, including the embedded ones, have been done without ever needing to even ask me anything.

Josh

Well, I respect Peter a lot and consider him a very competent developer. I believe he knows what he's talking about.

Also, it seems to me you are forgetting about all the rants from the Matroska developers.

Besides, Peter did a very detailed list of the problems he's having with Flac. The only attitude I saw you take in that thread is dismiss it as some sort of conspiracy.

yup....
<Case> we should strip support for all extra FLAC features from foo_flac
<Case> just make it able to decode plain flac files and read ID3v2 tags
<Case> no more issues
<Case> that's how other FLAC devices handle it

Yes guys, it seems to me like you should all get off jcoalson's back. He's written (or co-written?) a really rather good FREE audio codec. He's not forcing anyone to use it, he's not making any money off it, and everyone should just be grateful.

If you don't like FLAC, use Wavpack, or Monkey's etc.

We don't use FLAC, we only maintain software that supports it. Should we drop FLAC support and let those who like it worry ?

But I don't think the problem is that anybody is forced to use it. On the contrary developers like Peter and Case are also working for free and they would like to see FLAC working with its full potential without problems in Foobar2000, because people want it.

You should say that to Peter. "If you don't like Flac, just support WavPack, Monkey, etc. in your player. Screw the users"

I challenge that interpretation too. Lets just please let the thread speak for itself instead of piling more opinion on top of it.

I'm getting tired of having to repeat the same stuff over and over. I'm not saying "screw the users", I'm not ignoring Peter's feedback. The fact remains that I don't have a lot of free time to work on those things right now.

Let's take them one at a time.

1. no seeking/tagging in OggFLAC: acknowledged. seeking is in CVS but untested.
2. file-unaware comment/metadata editing: acknowledged. on the list. fb2k has workaround
3. msvc project file fixes: acknowledged. peter fixed them; I never got a patch.
4. case's 'error detection/correction' bug: FLAC has no error correction. I can't reproduce problems with error detection or error recovery; the decoder correctly strips or silences bad frames for me. maybe the discontinuity to silence is causing a pop? I don't know
5. christian's 'detecting frame boundary' request: I already explained how to do this in another thread. it must have stuck since it seems to be working in MKA now.

So does all this make me pick up my toys and go home, complaining about foobar2000? No, I still plug it to people all the time when they complain about winamp. So what's with all the bile?

Josh

edit: delete first quote, thought roberto was addressing me

I did not. I only removed foo_flac project from dependency tree so it doesn't break itself when I hit "rebuild all". Seems like it didn't happen last time I checked but I'm not sure.

Good to hear about seeking, I'll test that. Foo_flac includes tagging for OggFLAC btw...


I started hunting down the problem after seeing your post and careful examination revealed that it was problem in our code. But it took quite a bit of effort to get garbage skipping working properly as module documentation doesn't seem specific enough about error codes or function return values in these situations.

I'll be suprised if it works because I only got to the point of getting the new layers to compile before getting swamped at work again. I don't think even the unit tests pass yet.

Josh

I just finished adding the code to foo_flac and it does work. Some code cleaning needs to be done as there are some bogus error messages being reported but that will have to wait until tommow.

And guys , dont forget !
Flac is open source

It's free and everyone can download the code and submit to jcoalson
I'm sure if the fix is good he would aply it to the cvs.

Foo_flac source cleanup project finished and seeking in OggFLAC works nicely. Only weidness I have seen so far is that errorcallback is called with one or two second intervals with status value FLAC__STREAM_DECODER_SEARCH_FOR_METADATA.