With all the new headphones its hard to keep track, so what are some good headphones, my pair broke so I need some new ones.

What purpose?

If primary purpose is for analysis/testing and/or feed monitoring, the Sony MDR-7506(also badged MDR-V6 - NOT V600) is an excellent value in my opinion. It features rugged construction(stainless band and stainless joints, heavy cord with rugged plug) and has a percieved linear response, comparing to live feeds with linear measurement mics, standing at the same distance as the microphones, A/Bing with the live sources. I don't know how to better compare in this fashion. However, this headphone seems to me, to have virtually the same tonal balance as the acoustic sources in the specified conditinos above. Ex loudspeaker engineer John Dunlavy had the same opinion, in the same conditions as I stated. However, for general listening, this headphone may not be as attractive. It is best used as a reference device. The price in US is $100(MDR-7506)/$70(MDR-V6) USD.

-Chris

What's yer budget?

how about general listening?

(like $60-70 or less or maybe a bit more, whatever is good for the money)

Unlike with the 7506, which I was specifying as compared to a direct reference, I can not make any claims of which headphones sound 'best', as this is not the same as 'same', which is what I was attempting to do with the live comparisions.

I can, however, suggest several lower price( approx. $100 or less) headphones that are repeatedly suggested by others on headphone forums. These are not listed in any order. I do not nsecarrily endorse any of these units for listening. List based only on some popular models. Hopefully, you will recieve some additional recommendations in this thread.

-Grado SR60
-Grado SR80
-Senheisser PX200
-Koss Portapro
-Sony MDR-7506/MDR-V6
-Senheisser HD-280
-Sony MDR-D66
-Audio Technica ATH-500

-Chris

Pick up a set of the Grado SR-60s - you won't want to put them back down. You'll be hard pressed to find a set of 'phones that sound nearly as good at tripple the price.

Might as well add Sennheiser HD497 to the short list.

PX100 is better. Same price (€25), more confortabel, better sound...

I would also add the Beyerdynamic DT-231 to that list. I own a pair and they sound really good for the price. Compared to the Sennheiser HD-600 they are a little bright and lack some bass but still make very competent listening phones. They are also the most comfortable thing I have ever put on my head. They are certainly the best sub $100 phones I have ever heard. At ~$55 they really represent excellent value.

The Grado SR60s are also great phones, they are a little more expensive and I find them pretty uncomfortable. Headphone comfort is very, very subjective though.

Have you taken a look at HeadRoom and the HeadFi Forums?

I will plug www.headphone.com here; excellent site, lots of reviews.

(For $60, my pick is Grado SR60. For $150, the Grado SR125, for $200, the Sennheiser HD580. However, I've killed two pairs of 580s recently with shock to the drivers, so I may be sticking with Grado all the way up the line from here on in... A pity, the HD580s are otherwise utterly flawless in execution. Great sound, incredibly comfortable; worth much more than $200 street IMHO)

Monty

I'll put in a vote for the Grado SR-60's too. In terms of price/performance ratio, nothing beats them, and they work great being driven by a portable machine. Many of the other headphones listed need an amp to sound good, while the SR-60's have a low enough impedance that most portables can drive them without a problem.

A coworker put me on to them and I couldn't believe the difference between them and the pair that came with my portable, and I thought they sounded pretty good.

SONY MDR-CD780 http://www.audioreview.com/PRD_126612_2750crx.aspx

There should be a "best soundcard/headphones for the money / what should I buy?" F.A.Q.

I have those and have not been very happy with them. They are not very comfortably to me. After a few hours they start hurting my ears.
The sound is fine to me though, so it might be different for you.

I am very pleased with the Grado 60's, a very good value in the $60 US price range. Have Senn PX200's for outside portableuse and travel.

I got Senn HD580s a while back for $135. Wonderful when listening both through the headphone jack on our amplifier (Yamaha CA-810, seems to have a pretty good connection) and through the headphone amp (META 42, JMT built - a little wider, more subtle sound).

I have these, actually, and rather enjoy them. I happened across a refurbished pair for $32 at ecost.com. They usually go for around $100. If you can find them for a good amount under $100, I'd say go for them. They are the most comfortable headphones I've ever used.

I have the Grado SR-60s and I'm quite happy with them. They really are a bargin considering that they don't need a dedicated amp to sound good (unlike many other nice headphones). I've found them to be pretty comfortable (I usually get sick of listening to music before my ears get sore), so like others have mentioned, comfort when it comes to headphones is definately a personal thing. I did have to stretch them out a bit to make them fit my fat head, so if somebody finds them uncomfortable it may be something worth trying (but be careful, since it's not really reversable).

Yes, Grado's are sweet. I have the SR-80s. You can get them for around $100. They have more bass than the SR-60s. Seriously amazing headphones for especially for rock.

No, you don't need an amp for Grados, but they sound better with one--as probably any headphone does. If you're into DIY you can build one pretty easily, if not you'll still be more than happy with the cans...

you should try them for yourself, too. i can't STAND the way Grados mash on my ears. OTOH, while i LOVE the way my Sennheisers feel so open, they still hurt after an hour or three. not sure if i need to wrap it around a stack of books, or what, but i need to do something about how tight they seem to become after a while

Do you have any measurements, correlating to JNDs, showing benefit of an 'amp' for headphones? I can certanly understand, and agree, that one is needed when the impedance/voltage requirements are not satisfied for adequate performance.

I suspect that for the most part, most{1} differences 'heard' are a result of psychological influence, not actual differences among the audio signal. If a inear/durable/versatile headphone amp is needed that featues hi quality audio signal amplification, Rolls makes one that has multiple outputs/level controls, metal enclosurefor about $60 or so bucks, I believe. Personally, I would sooner look towards professionally oriented amplification/signal control equipment before the equipment that markets itselft with features that unsubstaniated to relate to an audible difference, such as mainly exists in the 'audiophile' market.

-Chris

{1} I do suspect that some, select, so called 'hi-end' variants my have purposefully induced frequency resopnse difference(s) at a level of severity that is audible and/or may also induce audible 2nd order distortion(in cases of some tube variations).

The Sennheiser HD280 pros sound great and, IMO, you cant beat them under the $100 dollar price range (I got mine for $70.00)

"Our highest marks for the best sounding sealed headphone. And not expensive either!" - HeadRoom

I have a pair of 7506s myself. I use them for monitoring when I play drums, live and post sound engineering, and of course my computer audio and music listening needs. They are nice headphones. I can wear them all day and they're still comfortable, and the sound is so good I can tell the difference between the front and back audio jacks on the computers at work.

They're pretty much industry standard for monitoring. I work in television and nearly every sound board I see has a pair of 7506s attached.

$100 at Guitar Center or an online music supply store like Musiciansfriend. Can't beat 'em.

Only thing is, they're accurate, not good sounding. For good sounding, go with Bose or something.

Don't go with Bose unless you want to overpay.
If you plan on the HD497's, HD280's or any Grados be sure to audition them first to ascertain comfort and output preference.

The HD580/HD600 are my personal favorite headphones, but the 580's tend to run at least $160 and the 600's are usually $100+ more.

Another warning about the MDR-7506 to the original poster: The 7506 does not fit some wears correctly. The ear pads should surround your ears and press against your head directly. If the pads do not touch your head with adeqkuate pressure, the lower midrange will sound 'thin'. You can purchase earpads for the Beyer DT-250 that are slightly deeper, that will fit on the MDR-7506, that may alleviate this problem in some cases.

-Chris

I have some Grado SR-80s and Sennheiser PX-200s. I love the sound from the Grado headphones a lot, but I'd also like to point out that they are uncomfortable for extended periods of time. The PX-200s are closed, but are very comfortable and great for portable use (I have an iPod).

anyone have an opinion about the Bose Triport ($150)? i was thinking of buying one - but am now wondering if it is worth the premium?

I've owned quite a few pairs of headphones. At the moment, my suggestions would be entirely depending on your budget.

For $20 you can pick up a pair of Phillips HP-170s which, despite their cheap construction, sound very decent for $20.

For about $70-110 depending where you shop, you can get the aformentioned Sony MDR-7506/V6s (Note, do NOT get the V600s, not the same beast and in my opinion... not as good). The differences between the V6 and the 7506 are strictly the gold-plated connector on the 7506 and a higher price. They use the same drivers, though some would love to argue the 7506 has better matching for driver pairs.

Now if you got even more money than this, I'd say go with the Sennheiser HD-580s (About or under $200) or the Sennheiser HD-650s (Somewhere between $350 and 400). At this point, you're going to need an amp more than likely to drive them. There's two amps out there you can build yourself, the PPA and the Kevil Gilmore class A amp. You can find prebuilts of both amps for sale at prices that will likely make you twitch, but you might as well go for it if you don't feel like building it yourself. I know the Gilmores built at HeadAmp are supposed to be pretty decent. I personally wouldn't go all out on the amp. I'd also ignore people saying you need amazing cables for them -- I'd get a pair of interconnects from a place like Blue Jeans Cables or somesuch or better yet.. make your own interconnects! Belden cable is great for that.

And if you really just want to go all out.. Get a pair of Stax Omega II electrostatic headphones ($1200-2000 depending on new/used, etc.), get either Stax's own amp for it or build one of Gilmore's amps for it (plans @ HeadWize) and never worry about the question ever again.

As far as what I use the most? I use a pair of Sony MDR-7506es out of an M-Audio Revolution 7.1 as of late. Sure, I got a pair of Sennheiser HD-600s, a nice amp and a decent CD player, but I primarily listen to everything on my PC and I find this setup to be less of a fuss. Sure, I'm taking a slight loss in what I could possibly be hearing, but I'm past the stage of actually caring. This is the exact setup I'd suggest to anyone who wishes to have a quality setup without going nuts.

Also: I don't like the Bose Triports. They're overpriced pieces of plastic crap. But that's like mose Bose products, really.

I have the HD-580's plugged into a Turtle Beach Santa Cruz soundcard. If I run the Santa Cruz at full volume for more than a few seconds, my ears start ringing. Unless you're on a campaign to deafen yourself, or you have a junk soundcard, you shouldn't need an amp with these headphones.

I owned the Sony V6's before these. Those things were really rugged, and they lasted a lot longer than they should have, with the abuse I gave them. I find the HD-580's more comfortable for long-term listening sessions. They don't have the punch that the closed-backed Sony's have, but the bass can be heard, and midrange (especially cymbals and fade-outs) sound much better to my ears. If you can find a good price on eBay, try to buy them. I know $150 may sound like a lot for headphones, but think about how much you'd have to spend on an amp and speakers to get sound this good...

Well, the entire topic of headphone preferences is pretty much completely subjective. You can't just look at a frequency graph or specifications and determine whether you'll like the sound or not, you pretty much just have to listen. Many people are duped into buying poor sounding headphones (for the money) such as Sony V600s based on the specs on the package.

I'd say the same subjectiveness goes for the amplifier. So I'll just say that to me, using an amp improves the sound of my Grados. The improvement is rather drastic compared to my portable source, and mild compared to my stereo receiver source. I'm guessing the main reason for the improvement is current draw capability--Grados are low-impedance phones that don't require much voltage gain--I only used a gain of 3 on my amps.



I built all my amps from scratch and I understand how they work, so this is not the case for me at least.

Edit: accidently put Sony V6s instead of V600s

For a while I was running the HD-600s, which have the same impedence rating (300 Ohm) and pretty much the same driver as the HD-580s right out of my soundcard (as stated earlier, a Revo 7.1) without an amp. I've got no real way of ABXing this or otherwise backing this, however, but it is notable to myself that I had a bit better bass definition out of the Senns with an amp at rather normal listening levels. This is part of why I prefer the MDR-7506es with the soundcard, because they're far easier to drive than the Senns.

However, I'd kill for the comfort of my HD-600s with the 7506es. I'll probably do a pad mod to put comfier pads on eventually, since the Sony's like to pinch my ears over time.

You can swap comfy Beyer velour pads into the V6/7506s. Do a search on headwize.com or head-fi.org

[quote=freakngoat,Jun 7 2004, 12:34 AM] [QUOTE=WmAx,Jun 6 2004, 07:56 PM] You can't just look at a frequency graph or specifications and determine whether you'll like the sound or not, you pretty much just have to listen. Many people are duped into buying poor sounding headphones (for the money) such as Sony V600s based on the specs on the package.

I'd say the same subjectiveness goes for the amplifier. So I'll just say that to me, using an amp improves the sound of my Grados. The improvement is rather drastic compared to my portable source, and mild compared to my stereo receiver source. I'm guessing the main reason for the improvement is current draw capability--Grados are low-impedance phones that don't require much voltage gain--I only used a gain of 3 on my amps.


[/quote]
Headphones have different frequency response/impluse response behaviours. The differences are drastic, and almost always exceed JNDs. As for amplifiers, any proper designed unit should have a frequency response that is within 0.1-0.2db from 20hz-20khz. Distortion is easily kept well under JNDs in solid state designs. Delayed energy storage, while a real factor in headphones, due to the various mechanical properties of the transducer, air cavity resonances,e tc.. The specificy q and amplitude of the resonances will affect percieved timbre. Another variable. This is not an issue in amplifiers. Any energy storage characertistics demonstated with an amplifier would be linear in behviour, dictated solely by the frequency response.

As I stated initially, if you want to find a 'real' amplifier difference, show measurments that differences that correlate with known audible JNDs or a validated DBT or ABX protocol test that stand under scrutiny. If this is not done, then you can not rule out psychological factors as affecting perception.

-Chris

I had that problem for about the first week or so I had them. I had to take them off after a couple hours because my ears would hurt. However, since then I've never had this problem. They now fit very comfortably and have great sound.

No it is not IMO. I'd suggest spending another $20 or so and picking up some HD580s.


The Santa Cruz supposedly has extremely robust integrated amplification for a sound card, which may actually make a difference.

Hmm. Please don't take my opinions as though I am preaching gospel here. Even if I could somehow rig up some sort of contraption to ABX my amp, I wouldn't for this thread. I'm giving my subject opinion here. This entire thread is based on everyone's subjective opinion. Take it or leave it. However, I will say that my opinion is in agreement with the general consensus on headwise.com and head-fi.org, if that adds anything to the credibility of it. Maybe you should take up this issue there.

I do see and respect what you're saying about the whole placebo effect and all, but I think you're misunderstanding the context of this thread.

Ok. Understood. I was just trying to balance the thread, urging people to notice that their may be a signficant difference between perceptual and actual differences in specific circumstances.



Unfortunately, 'general consensus' has no bearing on the issue, as far as what the actual cause may 'be' on differesnt perceptions of amplifiers. I have taken 'it up' on head-fi site you mentino in the past, but no one has yet shown me the data I requested in order to confirm their assertion(s).

I don't have a problem with people getting the sound they like, whether it's actual or only percieved. However, in the case of this rapidly increasing price scale, I try to ensure that they realize it may only be a perception, and then decide if they still want to spend extra money for what may ultimately be a 'placebo'.

-Chris

Fair enough. Yes, headphone amplifiers are expensive, and they do have a ridiculously increasing price scale. Just look at some of the amps on headphone.com. That's why I suggest building one yourself; they are great simple little projects.

The cool thing about headphones though is that you can get extremely high sound quality for the price compared to a stereo/speaker setup.

It's not necessary to spend much for a good headphone amp. I'd recommend the Headsave Home-vibe myself (as a stationary amp) or go-vibe (portable), here:

http://www.headsave.com/vibe.html

The stationary model $85 (less shipping and power supply), and sounds as good to me as a supposedly higher end amp I have (Headsave Ultra) based on the Meta42 design, which I paid over $200 for. Measures just as well also, in fact a bit better:

http://jusstuff.home.comcast.net/hvcompare.htm

Re: headphones... IMO, for general listening purposes the best price/performance on the higher end are the Sennheiser HD-580s, although they're widely regarded as too 'laid back' sounding for rock/metal. Etymotic (ER4S/P) have dropped in price lately, and look to be a true bargain around $220. Grado SR-225 are widely recommended as being among the best for guitar rock.