Full Version: gaybar2000
Most of (ex-)Nullsoft employees are not only blatantly incompetent, but also childish and proud of it. One of them has set up a web site to insult Peter recently (also violating FAAD2's GPL license); and then one of his friends spammed it on HA afterwards. I think these links say it all about what kind of intelligent response you should be expecting from Nullsoft.
QUOTE(rpop @ Jul 30 2004, 04:36 AM)
Most of (ex-)Nullsoft employees are not only blatantly incompetent, but also childish and proud of it. One of them has set up a web site to insult Peter recently (also violating FAAD2's GPL license); and then one of his friends spammed it on HA afterwards. I think these links say it all about what kind of intelligent response you should be expecting from Nullsoft.
Generalizations are often a bad thing...
Mhh... this gaybar2000 may be in competition with foobar2000.
To be honest I don't like Winamp 5.x either, I like the old 2.x series best, I'm using 2.95. I really started to like Winamp 3 but it's just too buggy & lacking simple features.
I don't want to start a flame war just my personal opinion after all it's just a GUI & plug-ins that make up a good player, to each his own.
Edit: Look at this!
winampunlimited
To be honest I don't like Winamp 5.x either, I like the old 2.x series best, I'm using 2.95. I really started to like Winamp 3 but it's just too buggy & lacking simple features.
I don't want to start a flame war just my personal opinion after all it's just a GUI & plug-ins that make up a good player, to each his own.
Edit: Look at this!
winampunlimited
QUOTE
Regarding Winamp’s future, Will Fisher stated the following, reporting from Winamp’s developers:
Christophe, Francis and Mig have all decided to move on to greater things. They have done great work over the years and they are awesome.
However, Steve, Biderman, Tag, Tom and all the web team and other people still remain.
There is going to be a bit of a break in development until more coders get hired. It really isn’t that big of a deal.
Christophe, Francis and Mig have all decided to move on to greater things. They have done great work over the years and they are awesome.
However, Steve, Biderman, Tag, Tom and all the web team and other people still remain.
There is going to be a bit of a break in development until more coders get hired. It really isn’t that big of a deal.
QUOTE
Most of (ex-)Nullsoft employees are not only blatantly incompetent, but also childish and proud of it.
yep.
QUOTE(westgroveg @ Jul 29 2004, 11:53 PM)
To be honest I don't like Winamp 5.x either, I like the old 2.x series best, I'm using 2.95.
Winamp 5.x is Winamp 2.x, with a couple of optional plug-ins bundled in along with fixes. Think of 5.04 as a sort of Winamp 2.98.
QUOTE(rpop @ Jul 29 2004, 06:36 PM)
Most of (ex-)Nullsoft employees are not only blatantly incompetent, but also childish and proud of it. One of them has set up a web site to insult Peter recently (also violating FAAD2's GPL license); and then one of his friends spammed it on HA afterwards. I think these links say it all about what kind of intelligent response you should be expecting from Nullsoft.
It's a bit of strech to say an someone from NS set up the site. Sounds a bit tabloid-ish, actually. Not sure if you were around when Menno stopped by, but as I said, the actions of one or two isn't representative of the rest of us who were hanging around.
As for ex-NS employees being incompetent, that just sounds like blatant narrow-mindedness. You're talking about the people behind Geiss/Milkdrop, Gnutella, Litestep, along with dozens of other projects. Peter's even done some work for'em int he past, if I remember right. I know it's a bit unfair to ask since you seem kind of young, but do you really feel your accomplishments are comparable?
Menno and Garf have stopped by a couple of times, and as far as I know, they haven't been handled roughly.
Cheers.
gray_ghost: You forgot WASTE, shoutcast, NSV and k-jofol.
QUOTE(gray ghost @ Jul 30 2004, 08:21 AM)
It's a bit of strech to say an someone from NS set up the site. Sounds a bit tabloid-ish, actually. Not sure if you were around when Menno stopped by, but as I said, the actions of one or two isn't representative of the rest of us who were hanging around.
As for ex-NS employees being incompetent, that just sounds like blatant narrow-mindedness. You're talking about the people behind Geiss/Milkdrop, Gnutella, Litestep, along with dozens of other projects. Peter's even done some work for'em int he past, if I remember right. I know it's a bit unfair to ask since you seem kind of young, but do you really feel your accomplishments are comparable?
As for ex-NS employees being incompetent, that just sounds like blatant narrow-mindedness. You're talking about the people behind Geiss/Milkdrop, Gnutella, Litestep, along with dozens of other projects. Peter's even done some work for'em int he past, if I remember right. I know it's a bit unfair to ask since you seem kind of young, but do you really feel your accomplishments are comparable?
I didn't say the actions of one or two were responsible for everyone, or that ALL ex-nullsoft employees are behind it. And I don't see what my significance my personal accomplishments bear on the site and thread insulting Peter.
QUOTE(gray ghost @ Jul 30 2004, 08:21 AM)
Menno and Garf have stopped by a couple of times, and as far as I know, they haven't been handled roughly.
When I was there, Menno kindly asked that gay_input_std be removed, because it uses FAAD2 code which they don't have a permission to distribute in binary form. The response he received was "I will remove it when monkeys come flying out my butt". Further attempts at communication were generally discouraged by public notices such as "toqer is now known as toqer|eatingdontfuckingbothermeaboutfaad2rightnowmenno".
Hmm. Maybe I missed an imortant part. who is responsible for this gaybar site (what [ex]employee)? Or is it just a guess that it could be a Nullsoft (ex) employee?
I myself find the site rather funny. Not really worth letting the emotions grow that much.
EDIT: And we should move back to the topic. Winamp 5.04. Not foobar, not gaybar, not possible (ex) employees.
I myself find the site rather funny. Not really worth letting the emotions grow that much.
EDIT: And we should move back to the topic. Winamp 5.04. Not foobar, not gaybar, not possible (ex) employees.
QUOTE(amano @ Jul 30 2004, 07:52 AM)
I myself find the site rather funny. Not really worth letting the emotions grow that much.
I'd find it funny too, but the intent appears to be to insult rather than to be funny. The gaybar2000 joke has been brought up before on #foobar2000.
QUOTE(rpop @ Jul 30 2004, 07:45 AM)
QUOTE(gray ghost @ Jul 30 2004, 08:21 AM)
It's a bit of strech to say an someone from NS set up the site. Sounds a bit tabloid-ish, actually. Not sure if you were around when Menno stopped by, but as I said, the actions of one or two isn't representative of the rest of us who were hanging around.
As for ex-NS employees being incompetent, that just sounds like blatant narrow-mindedness. You're talking about the people behind Geiss/Milkdrop, Gnutella, Litestep, along with dozens of other projects. Peter's even done some work for'em int he past, if I remember right. I know it's a bit unfair to ask since you seem kind of young, but do you really feel your accomplishments are comparable?
As for ex-NS employees being incompetent, that just sounds like blatant narrow-mindedness. You're talking about the people behind Geiss/Milkdrop, Gnutella, Litestep, along with dozens of other projects. Peter's even done some work for'em int he past, if I remember right. I know it's a bit unfair to ask since you seem kind of young, but do you really feel your accomplishments are comparable?
I didn't say the actions of one or two were responsible for everyone, or that ALL ex-nullsoft employees are behind it. And I don't see what my significance my personal accomplishments bear on the site and thread insulting Peter.
And not only Peter, as there's "ReplayGay" involved...
QUOTE(Canar @ Jul 31 2004, 02:17 AM)
I'd find it funny too, but the intent appears to be to insult rather than to be funny. The gaybar2000 joke has been brought up before on #foobar2000.
I found it more insulting to gay people than to foobar2000 or Peter. Even then, it is hardly worth bothering about. The more people get upset over it, the more it has done what it is meant to do.
Anyways, can we get back to talking about WinAmp 5.04 please.
Maybe a mod should split the whole gaybar discussion into a separate thread and should leave in here technical posts only.
toqer has virtually no involvement with nullsoft, and shouldn't be considered a representative of the company, or any other people in #nullsoft. he's just some karaoke nerd.
that said, winamp unlimited has some new information on the 5.04 release, as well as links to hints of a 5.04a release. some of the issues brought up here might be addresed by 5.04a.
that said, winamp unlimited has some new information on the 5.04 release, as well as links to hints of a 5.04a release. some of the issues brought up here might be addresed by 5.04a.
QUOTE(gray ghost @ Jul 31 2004, 10:28 AM)
toqer has virtually no involvement with nullsoft, and shouldn't be considered a representative of the company, or any other people in #nullsoft. he's just some karaoke nerd.
that said, winamp unlimited has some new information on the 5.04 release, as well as links to hints of a 5.04a release. some of the issues brought up here might be addresed by 5.04a.
that said, winamp unlimited has some new information on the 5.04 release, as well as links to hints of a 5.04a release. some of the issues brought up here might be addresed by 5.04a.
1) The person who runs that site, and attempted to troll HA apparently came from their irc channel (#nullsoft on irc.cockos.com), where these "activities" were coordinated
2) As you can see by whois, their irc server (of cockos.com domain) most certainly is owned by Nullsoft employees, by the person behind the "MP4 patent = $$$$$$$$$$$++" quote to be exact.
3) If they deny any involvement, why is the troll still on their irc channels? What he did was apparently approved by them, so was him insulting Menno on irc.
QUOTE(rpop @ Aug 2 2004, 11:38 AM)
3) If they deny any involvement, why is the troll still on their irc channels? What he did was apparently approved by them, so was him insulting Menno on irc.
Hrm... they don't need to approve the personal actions of everyone frequenting their IRC channels
One person that attempted DoS at gaybar2000.org (out of his own initiative) frequents #foobar2000, and noone there banned him for his actions. That would make no sense.
QUOTE(rjamorim @ Aug 2 2004, 10:44 AM)
QUOTE(rpop @ Aug 2 2004, 11:38 AM)
3) If they deny any involvement, why is the troll still on their irc channels? What he did was apparently approved by them, so was him insulting Menno on irc.
Hrm... they don't need to approve the personal actions of everyone frequenting their IRC channels
One person that attempted DoS at gaybar2000.org (out of his own initiative) frequents #foobar2000, and noone there banned him for his actions. That would make no sense.
According to Wikipedia, "a denial-of-service attack, or DoS attack, is an attack on a computer system or network that causes a loss of service to users, typically the loss of network connectivity and services." I don't know of any such attack being planned, and I haven't seen any loss of service to the users. Also, the only person reportedly involved in suspicious activities isn't frequenting #foobar2000 anymore.
QUOTE(rpop @ Aug 2 2004, 12:17 PM)
According to Wikipedia, "a denial-of-service attack, or DoS attack, is an attack on a computer system or network that causes a loss of service to users, typically the loss of network connectivity and services."
Well, I said attempted DoS, I never said the perpetrator succeeded
And yes, attempting a crime is nearly as bad as succeeding in it.
QUOTE(p0l1m0rph1c @ Jul 31 2004, 05:16 AM)
QUOTE(rpop @ Jul 30 2004, 07:45 AM)
QUOTE(gray ghost @ Jul 30 2004, 08:21 AM)
It's a bit of strech to say an someone from NS set up the site. Sounds a bit tabloid-ish, actually. Not sure if you were around when Menno stopped by, but as I said, the actions of one or two isn't representative of the rest of us who were hanging around.
As for ex-NS employees being incompetent, that just sounds like blatant narrow-mindedness. You're talking about the people behind Geiss/Milkdrop, Gnutella, Litestep, along with dozens of other projects. Peter's even done some work for'em int he past, if I remember right. I know it's a bit unfair to ask since you seem kind of young, but do you really feel your accomplishments are comparable?
As for ex-NS employees being incompetent, that just sounds like blatant narrow-mindedness. You're talking about the people behind Geiss/Milkdrop, Gnutella, Litestep, along with dozens of other projects. Peter's even done some work for'em int he past, if I remember right. I know it's a bit unfair to ask since you seem kind of young, but do you really feel your accomplishments are comparable?
I didn't say the actions of one or two were responsible for everyone, or that ALL ex-nullsoft employees are behind it. And I don't see what my significance my personal accomplishments bear on the site and thread insulting Peter.
And not only Peter, as there's "ReplayGay" involved...
Not to mention the gaybar2000.org forum which was named HydroGayAudio or something before they updated it to IPB 2.0 and resetted the whole forum...
Very childish and lame stuff from them.
But at the same time as it shows the maturity level of its creators, it is kinda a testimony that Peter is doing very good work; If Foobar2000 was a trivial player, nobody would use that much time and energy to create a site trying to disrespect it or HA for that matter.
QUOTE(gray ghost @ Jul 28 2004, 11:19 PM)
QUOTE(Halcyon @ Jul 28 2004, 12:11 PM)
Has anybody noticed that the difference in CPU utilization with the new modern skin vs the old skin is HUGE.
here's a quick guide on how to configure winamp to run like the wind
gray ghost: Why do you post something like this to winampunlimited.com
"Fans of the popular and lightweight audio player, Gaybar2000, will be chagrined to hear that the application’s site has been closed down due to complaints from the author of a rival audio player, Foobar2000. He claims the page is “willfull infringement of [his] rights under international copyright law and could be liable for statutory damages.” According to what’s been posted on the temporarily disabled site, Foobar’s original license has recently been altered to disallow the creation of derivative work such as Gaybar2000. Though the player suffered from a number of flaws like the lack of a Media Library or a volume bar, it was a decent player to fool around with every now and then. Hopefully they’ll square things out with Foobar2000’s people, and continue development soon."
You know just well that the site was created to dishonour Peter, Foobar2000 and Hydrogenaudio (the previous gaybar2000 forum was named HydroGayAudio).
Just for your info: Gaybar2000 breaks the FAAD license. You also probably know that there's no "Francois Corbier". There are logs showing that "Francois Corbier" is Christophe Thibault (nick r0n) who recently left Nullsoft.
We all remember gaybar2000 claiming 20000 (unlicensed) downloads of the player, so we will see what kind of compensations Ahead will be demanding soon.
Anyway, given to the fact that gaybar2000 is clearly made to offend, I can't but wonder why you write news like that on winampunlimited.com.
And your news is wrong, only the index.html is changed. There's still content on that site at the moment when I write this.
QUOTE(JohnV @ Aug 6 2004, 01:14 AM)
You also probably know that there's no "Francois Corbier". There are logs showing that "Francois Corbier" is Christophe Thibault (nick r0n) who recently left Nullsoft.
François Corbier? Was it the nick name of GayBar webmaster?
When I was a child (~15-20 years ago), François Corbier was a "singer" and an host on the most famous TV program for children (Club Dorothée). I remember very well his funny face:
If someone founded the GayBar site as something very childish, there's maybe an explanation in the Corbier's reference
EDIT: there's a website for this guy (the real one, probably not a Nullsoft developer):
http://www.francoiscorbier.com/
EDIT: according to the screenshot posted by the guy, done through google.fr, the guy is french
Entry edited to put Gaybar2000 in a lesser light. I will try to take Gaybar2000 more seriously in the future.
My apologies if my poor attempts at humor and/or light-hearted outlook on the debacle upset you. Feel free to email me with any additional changes you wish me to make, or information you'd like to report--as I don't have access to the same sources.
I'm not familiar with Francois Corbier, nor do I recall anything I've run into that might suggest that it is Christophe's alias.
My apologies if my poor attempts at humor and/or light-hearted outlook on the debacle upset you. Feel free to email me with any additional changes you wish me to make, or information you'd like to report--as I don't have access to the same sources.
I'm not familiar with Francois Corbier, nor do I recall anything I've run into that might suggest that it is Christophe's alias.
QUOTE(guruboolez @ Aug 6 2004, 03:27 AM)
I don't know if Thibault is french or not, I've anyway got loggings provided by some people from #nullsoft irc-channel. Here's one capture:
QUOTE
aug 05 03:05:38 * rOn (ron@dsl081-059-138.sfo1.dsl.speakeasy.net) has joined #nullsoft
(...)
aug 05 03:10:29 <rOn> HAHAHA
aug 05 03:10:35 <rOn> my isp received a C&D from PP for gaybar2000
(...)
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> If I have not received an affirmative response from you by the
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> 11th of August 2004 indicating that you have fully complied with these
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> requirements, I shall see myself forced to take further action against you.
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> - Peter Pawlowski
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> Author, foobar2000 media player, foobar2000.org website
(...)
aug 05 03:12:55 <rOn> Furthermore, the site contains severe defamatory statements which have
aug 05 03:12:55 <rOn> clearly been published with malicious intent to damage my personality.
aug 05 03:12:57 <rOn> HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
(...)
aug 05 09:43:10 <rOn> This C&D thing has no value, the license provided in the file we downloaded from your site allows us to do so.
aug 05 09:43:12 <rOn> "Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, WITH or WITHOUT modification, are permitted..."
aug 05 09:43:12 <rOn> Read the license files you distribute better next time.
aug 05 09:43:12 <rOn> Sincerely,
aug 05 09:43:12 <rOn> The Gaybar2000 team
aug 05 09:43:20 <rOn> that's what I'm replying to pp
(...)
aug 05 03:10:29 <rOn> HAHAHA
aug 05 03:10:35 <rOn> my isp received a C&D from PP for gaybar2000
(...)
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> If I have not received an affirmative response from you by the
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> 11th of August 2004 indicating that you have fully complied with these
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> requirements, I shall see myself forced to take further action against you.
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> - Peter Pawlowski
aug 05 03:12:00 <rOn> Author, foobar2000 media player, foobar2000.org website
(...)
aug 05 03:12:55 <rOn> Furthermore, the site contains severe defamatory statements which have
aug 05 03:12:55 <rOn> clearly been published with malicious intent to damage my personality.
aug 05 03:12:57 <rOn> HAHAHAHAHAHAHA
(...)
aug 05 09:43:10 <rOn> This C&D thing has no value, the license provided in the file we downloaded from your site allows us to do so.
aug 05 09:43:12 <rOn> "Redistribution and use in source and binary forms, WITH or WITHOUT modification, are permitted..."
aug 05 09:43:12 <rOn> Read the license files you distribute better next time.
aug 05 09:43:12 <rOn> Sincerely,
aug 05 09:43:12 <rOn> The Gaybar2000 team
aug 05 09:43:20 <rOn> that's what I'm replying to pp
.. funnily that reply was later emailed from "Francois Corbier" email account to Peter... What a coincidence...
(r0n is the known nick of Christophe. For those who don't know this see for example here )
QUOTE(gray ghost @ Aug 6 2004, 03:48 AM)
Entry edited to put Gaybar2000 in a lesser light. I will try to take Gaybar2000 more seriously in the future.
My apologies if my poor attempts at humor and/or light-hearted outlook on the debacle upset you. Feel free to email me with any additional changes you wish me to make, or information you'd like to report--as I don't have access to the same sources.
I'm not familiar with Francois Corbier, nor do I recall anything I've run into that might suggest that it is Christophe's alias.
My apologies if my poor attempts at humor and/or light-hearted outlook on the debacle upset you. Feel free to email me with any additional changes you wish me to make, or information you'd like to report--as I don't have access to the same sources.
I'm not familiar with Francois Corbier, nor do I recall anything I've run into that might suggest that it is Christophe's alias.
Yeah, the dishonouring of HA admin, HA itself, Foobar2000 etc. has gone too far. So you can just post news which asks Cristophe to delete the site entirely and apologize to the parties involved as quickly as possible. If you are not convinced, go ask some of your friends who have logged #nullsoft...
But if I'd have to bet my money whether you really knew or not, considering you are a #nullsoft regular and author of winampunlimited and the news, there's no question how I'd bet.
And yes I am angry if you didn't notice.
Since the that MP4-tagging issue and the racism comments concerning unicode of winamp forum-moderators, it is my opinion, that ethics matter when choosing to use (consume) an app, because consuming/using means supporting. Opinions about this may differ - however, it would be nice to have a kind of centralized collection of all the disrespectful, abusive and power-mad actions which have and do surround nullsoft/winamp. Having a central place to which i could just give interested winamp-users the URL would make it much easier to make clueless(in that regard) winamp-users understand what kind of people they are supporting.
No, this is not a zealot-attemp to convert people from winamp to fb2k. There are lots of audioplayers in different flavours out there, and people shall choose which one they are most comfortable with. So, my intention is not to convert users to fb2k - but instead to make people stop using an audioplayer written and managed(including forums, etc) at least partially by people who are disrespectful, abusive, power-mad, and harmful to the audioworld and its technologies.
- Lyx
No, this is not a zealot-attemp to convert people from winamp to fb2k. There are lots of audioplayers in different flavours out there, and people shall choose which one they are most comfortable with. So, my intention is not to convert users to fb2k - but instead to make people stop using an audioplayer written and managed(including forums, etc) at least partially by people who are disrespectful, abusive, power-mad, and harmful to the audioworld and its technologies.
- Lyx
hehe. maybe electric six are developing their own audio player?
seriously, being called gay is so old-hat that i'm surprised it offends anyone at all. in fact, who would go to the effort of calling someone gay in the first place? a 14 year old geek with no friends but a pile of programming books maybe? who knows.
hehe. replaygay. that's actually really funny.
bear in mind i haven't seen the site yet - i was reading this thread. but i don't think this will hurt foobar2000 at all. just like "www.ihatebillgates.com" hasn't had a noticable effect on microsoft's earnings.
although the GPL violations should certainly be corrected. that's not cool at all. opensource software is sacred and should be respected (it's hard to believe that coders can rip coders off, but i suppose there are arseholes in this world just like there are altruists)
[edit]
hmmm.... site's gone. how bout that. with a rather sour-grapes notice left behind too. i wonder what happened to this guy to turn him (i assume it's a guy) so stupid? i've seen stuff like this on the net before, but i fail to understand why good guys get demonized by strange people like that. i suppose these are the same sort of people who think they were meant to be with some random celebrity, and wind up either in a bathtub full of their own blood, or in a prison cell with a bunch of other crackpots.
well, rant over
seriously, being called gay is so old-hat that i'm surprised it offends anyone at all. in fact, who would go to the effort of calling someone gay in the first place? a 14 year old geek with no friends but a pile of programming books maybe? who knows.
hehe. replaygay. that's actually really funny.
bear in mind i haven't seen the site yet - i was reading this thread. but i don't think this will hurt foobar2000 at all. just like "www.ihatebillgates.com" hasn't had a noticable effect on microsoft's earnings.
although the GPL violations should certainly be corrected. that's not cool at all. opensource software is sacred and should be respected (it's hard to believe that coders can rip coders off, but i suppose there are arseholes in this world just like there are altruists)
[edit]
hmmm.... site's gone. how bout that. with a rather sour-grapes notice left behind too. i wonder what happened to this guy to turn him (i assume it's a guy) so stupid? i've seen stuff like this on the net before, but i fail to understand why good guys get demonized by strange people like that. i suppose these are the same sort of people who think they were meant to be with some random celebrity, and wind up either in a bathtub full of their own blood, or in a prison cell with a bunch of other crackpots.
well, rant over
Well, after a very short (1.5s) of thinking, a "Francois Corbier" nickname and the Gaybar2000 name sounds a lot like Christophe things.
To know Corbier, you have to be french, and the Gaybar name sounds like KJofol for french peoples...
I will not comment regarding if this was meant to offend anyone or no, as I have clearly not enough information about this.
To know Corbier, you have to be french, and the Gaybar name sounds like KJofol for french peoples...
I will not comment regarding if this was meant to offend anyone or no, as I have clearly not enough information about this.
The guy is still using picmixer's alien icon as his favicon. Could that be taken care of?
About http://gaybar2000.org/ details:
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role: IPsyn Admins
address: 2 a 24 avenue Henri Barbusse , Centre ABC
address: IPsyn / Net-bios
address: 93000 BOBIGNY, FRANCE
phone: +1 309 294 0032
fax-no: +1 309 294 0032
e-mail: support@ipsyn.net
trouble: Information: http://www.ipsyn.net/
trouble: Spam: mailto:abuse@ipsyn.net
remarks: Peering: peering@ipsyn.net
admin-c: NS18-RIPE
tech-c: NS18-RIPE
nic-hdl: IP911-RIPE
notify: ripe@ipsyn.net
mnt-by: IPSYN-MNT
changed: ripe@ipsyn.net 20020528
source: RIPE
That's just the hoster. You can DNS dig gaybar2000.org too, but it won't help because the contact info there is fake. It's really ipsyn.net's responsibility to deal with this.
This is my, hopefully neutral, point of view on the issue.
The original foobar license was vauge. There is no argument about that, since it's recently been changed, and so that's effectively an admission of its vagueness. The question is whether the original license specified that parts of the player were not covered by it, and I don't believe it did. The only inkling that foo_input_std contained code which was covered by a seperate license from foobar itself is in the about box of the component itself, which is dubious [1].
On the other hand, gaybar2000.org is intended as parody, which in itself raises two major issues. Firstly, since the site is hosted in France and foobar is european too, is it actually covered by US law (I'd have thought not, but I don't really know)? Parody law tends not to be as strong in the EU (the concept of parody as an explicit exemption to copyright and trademark law is mainly a US invention), and if the parody is distributed beyond the US (which, as a web site, it obviously is), then you can be sued in a foreign court. This is significant, because it means that Peter or Ahead could technically sue gaybar2000 in a German court, under German law, which is significantly less lenient towards parodies [2].
Secondly, it's debatable whether it actually counts as parody at all, or whether it's libel, and hence is unprotected even in the US. This is for a judge to decide really, but I'll give you my take on it anyway. It's not actually funny or subtle, it didn't require any artistic creativity at all, and other than a quick find-and-replace, it's a direct copy.
Anyhow, those are my thoughts. Standard disclaimer applies: IANAL, I'm just interested in these things. This was mainly a thought experiment - I personally think the whole issue is stupid and should just be dropped.
[1] Don't get me wrong here... the whole idea of EULAs is untested legally.
[2] source
The original foobar license was vauge. There is no argument about that, since it's recently been changed, and so that's effectively an admission of its vagueness. The question is whether the original license specified that parts of the player were not covered by it, and I don't believe it did. The only inkling that foo_input_std contained code which was covered by a seperate license from foobar itself is in the about box of the component itself, which is dubious [1].
On the other hand, gaybar2000.org is intended as parody, which in itself raises two major issues. Firstly, since the site is hosted in France and foobar is european too, is it actually covered by US law (I'd have thought not, but I don't really know)? Parody law tends not to be as strong in the EU (the concept of parody as an explicit exemption to copyright and trademark law is mainly a US invention), and if the parody is distributed beyond the US (which, as a web site, it obviously is), then you can be sued in a foreign court. This is significant, because it means that Peter or Ahead could technically sue gaybar2000 in a German court, under German law, which is significantly less lenient towards parodies [2].
Secondly, it's debatable whether it actually counts as parody at all, or whether it's libel, and hence is unprotected even in the US. This is for a judge to decide really, but I'll give you my take on it anyway. It's not actually funny or subtle, it didn't require any artistic creativity at all, and other than a quick find-and-replace, it's a direct copy.
Anyhow, those are my thoughts. Standard disclaimer applies: IANAL, I'm just interested in these things. This was mainly a thought experiment - I personally think the whole issue is stupid and should just be dropped.
[1] Don't get me wrong here... the whole idea of EULAs is untested legally.
[2] source
QUOTE(MugFunky @ Aug 5 2004, 11:17 PM)
seriously, being called gay is so old-hat that i'm surprised it offends anyone at all. in fact, who would go to the effort of calling someone gay in the first place? a 14 year old geek with no friends but a pile of programming books maybe? who knows.
hehe. replaygay. that's actually really funny.
hehe. replaygay. that's actually really funny.
well I am gay, and I quite honestly find the whole thing to be a really pitiful attempt at an insult. (although they got the desired reaction)
QUOTE(russ @ Aug 6 2004, 10:27 AM)
The original foobar license was vauge. There is no argument about that, since it's recently been changed, and so that's effectively an admission of its vagueness. The question is whether the original license specified that parts of the player were not covered by it, and I don't believe it did. The only inkling that foo_input_std contained code which was covered by a seperate license from foobar itself is in the about box of the component itself, which is dubious [1].
So I notified the gaybar2000 people of that and gave them a fair chance to remove the code. I think rpop already posted their reaction to that ("I will remove it when monkeys come flying out my butt").
Menno
QUOTE(russ @ Aug 6 2004, 12:27 PM)
On the other hand, gaybar2000.org is intended as parody, which in itself raises two major issues.
No it's not. If it was intented as parody, there woulnd't be these cover up tries and false personalities. Parody is not like that. The site is made purely to insult and to annoy.
Legal issues aside, does anyone really care about this? It was vaguely amusing for about 3 seconds after the mention of 'replaygay', and thats it. It doesnt warrant a barrage of waffle. Anyone actually offended by something like that needs their head examined.
QUOTE(Lev @ Aug 6 2004, 01:47 PM)
Legal issues aside, does anyone really care about this? It was vaguely amusing for about 3 seconds after the mention of 'replaygay', and thats it. It doesnt warrant a barrage of waffle. Anyone actually offended by something like that needs their head examined.
Not really offended, but when there starts to be news on other sites and posts on winamp&other forums which are only meant to use the site to insult Peter/HA/Foobar2000 it's not so funny to watch anymore.
And you don't have to care about the trolls spamming gaybar2000 on HA, but for admin/mod team it means more work.
What people really see in general and not just in this issue is just the public surface.
QUOTE(Lev @ Aug 6 2004, 02:47 AM)
Legal issues aside, does anyone really care about this? It was vaguely amusing for about 3 seconds after the mention of 'replaygay', and thats it. It doesnt warrant a barrage of waffle. Anyone actually offended by something like that needs their head examined.
That's exactly what I thought. The site isn't really worth even mentioning...
QUOTE(menno @ Aug 6 2004, 06:34 AM)
So I notified the gaybar2000 people of that and gave them a fair chance to remove the code. I think rpop already posted their reaction to that ("I will remove it when monkeys come flying out my butt").
Did you notify them legally, through a registered Cease and Desist letter?
Notify who? Mr. Francois Corbier the singer?
We are dealing with the hoster now.
We are dealing with the hoster now.
QUOTE
I quite honestly find the whole thing to be a really pitiful attempt at an insult.
that's my point... it's quite pitiful indeed ("gay bar" is an awesome song though... far too loud with a replaygain of -11.24 dB, but it works for that CD somehow).
i'd be interested to find out who the perpetrator in this is... so i can point and LMFAO at them.
[edit]
@ mods:
this thread should be closed for now... possibly re-opened if there's some new developments in this pathetic story, but for now all that needs saying has really been said.
QUOTE(Garf @ Aug 6 2004, 11:18 AM)
Notify who? Mr. Francois Corbier the singer?
Hrm. I thought we were discussing here on the legal grounds, starting from russ' post.
On legal grounds, notifying someone through IRC or e-mail has 0 value. So, it's no use if Menno notified the site author or not.
apart from insults, were their any other things being done, like posting source code of foobar? if not why is there discussion of GPL and Source code stuff....??
looks like i am a bit late on the news
looks like i am a bit late on the news
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