Are samples still required. I reformatted my ipod mini today and noticed a track from Static-X's Start A War album skipped, i was riding my mtb at the time and it's a new album so i didn't know the track. I can listen through it again if anyone would like the sample?

Cheers,

Kristian

vbrfix fixed the samples for me when i put it on my ipod mini. cool

interesting... but it really doesn't seem to make sense... not that i'm doubting you... but it doesn't go along with the theory.

was your ipod unplugged from the computer when you played the sample? did you reset it?

Yes it was unplugged, and I turned off equalizer.

Not sure what you mean by resetting it, I didn't think that was neccessary

If VBR fix really does have an effect on some files, I still have to wonder if this issue somehow has anything to do with another glitch I found with iTunes and my 2G mini: songs having incorrect length values written in the tag. I had albums like Tommy where songs would cut off 20 seconds too soon, but would play fine in iTunes. When I went into the file properties, and ticked both the end-length button and "update," the problem went away. I suspect the VBR problems we're having are an issue with both the tags AND clock-speed optimization; if it were simply a clock-speed thing, using VBR fix to rewrite the header wouldn't have any effect. Likewise, if it were simply a clock speed thing, then wouldn't ALL 320kbps MP3 frames (even those encoded by iTunes, God forbid) skip and stutter? I wish Apple would address this.

Needless to say, I quickly re-encoded my lossless files to 192kbps AAC for use with the iPod. I realize that this isn't an option for some, though.

interesting argument. this hassle is done for me though. I'm transcoding everything I want to transfer to 128kbps AAC. not only to avoid VBR skipping, but so I can cram more on my iPod. and the sound difference isn't very noticable to my ears

I'd go with 160 if I were you; the difference between 192kbps and 160kbps is apt to be pretty small (if even perceivable on the majority of samples), but 128kbps starts to become noticeable, especially when transcoding. (I tried transcoding some old --aps and PsyTel --extreme tracks to 128kbps QT AAC to save some space on my iPod and almost immediately settled for the original tracks ).

Edit: details.

I'm skeptical when you say VBRfix fixed the problem files.

Do a reset to make sure (hold select + menu for a few seconds). Sometimes the 2G mini inexplicably gets stuck with clock speed optimization shut off. When that happens the problem files will play fine and the battery will drain about 3x faster than it should. I suspect this is what's happening to yours.

I'm pretty sure you'll find out

honestly,

the vbrfix thing seemed to work for me on at least one file (Fiery Furnaces - Single Again).... but i tried it for another (The New Pornographers - The End of Medicine) and it did not work.

The rock eq setting didn't seem to work for me either... but i've tried the Acoustic eq setting and that one appears to do the trick, at least for the New Pornographers song.

(of course, i resetted the ipod and it was unplugged from the computer, both times.)

edit:
for me, getting rid of the stuttering is definitely a combination of having Sound Check On and Equalizer set to Acoustic.

I will try the equalizer on acoustic setting when I get home. Currently mine is on Rock (to avoid the skipping problem) and I haven't noticed any skips since on my everyday music.

I always have Sound Check on and the problem did occur when I had SoundCheck on and the EQ off.

has anyone tried linux on 2G? i would, but i just got this puppy and i'm afraid of getting a very very small coaster that would only be good for dixie cups

my new ipod 60gb skips too, but not much. can't wait for a fix. this mp3 player is here to stay (being serious this time)

does anyone know what sound check actually does?

i'm guessing it's kind of a normalization option... since some mp3 files can be very loud and some very quiet.

Yup, its a normalization utility. You sound check all your files in iTunes, transfer it to Ipod, and turn it on (if you want normalization). It's good because if you get sick of same volume you can turn it off (unlike mp3 gain where you have to undo it then re-transfer).

Downside though is that it uses more battery ,and I've heard mp3gain works better to achieve normalization.

foo_pod converts replaygain info to soundcheck when uploading to the iPod

Just out of curiosity... has anyone experienced any stuttering w/ alt-preset extreme or alt-preset medium?

The specific settings you mention has not been tested. However the problem has only been seen when lame VBR is allowed to go to 320 kbps:

Test lame settings

For what it's worth, I tried Nine Inch Nails - Right Where It Belongs:

lame 3.96.1
--alt-preset extreme: still stutters badly (not quite as bad as standard)
--alt-preset medium: no stutter

Scanning through this thread it seems like only a handful of songs are experiencing this issue. Has anyone had experience with a large number of APS songs experiencing this issue? If not, would a simple solution not be to encode these small number of songs with --preset CBR 256 instead of APS? Seems easier than changing the equalizer settings for all songs.

Well, yes and no. We're only taking note of songs that show obvious stuttering. Many more APS songs have minor skips/stutters, not worth discussing.



Re-ripping to CBR is one solution. For those who are unwilling/unable to re-rip the EQ is the way to go, though you have to watch out for distortion.

This is my first post on hydrogenaudio.org, but I've been following this topic with some interest.

I have an iPod Photo 60 GB and experience the stuttering problem as described. Granted the only track I have that is listed as experiencing the problem is the NIN "Right Where It Belongs".

Out of curiosity I tried the latest alpha version of lame (3.97a12; yes I know it isn't recommended but several people are reporting good results) with the settings -V2 --vbr-new; no noticeable stuttering. (Yes the iPod was disconnected). Has anyone else noticed this?

Apple today discontinued their iPod mini line.

It's very unlikely that they will ever fix the stuttering issue...

Good. Time to move on. Try the Nano, or just get something from another brand.

(How long do you figure it is before Creative Labs sues Apple for using the same name as one of their series?)

yea can someone let us know if nano has the skip issue? that's kind of a big deciding factor. also transfer speeds.

how am i going to toss my 60gb photo?

I'm throwing in the towel. Since I have an iMac, a shuffle, and soon an iPod Nano and iTunes 5 now has VBR (ie. ABR ) I'm going with AAC 192 VBR instead of LAME MP3 APS. No stuttering worries for me anymore.

Oh - and my Mini will soon be on eBay

That makes two of us

I'm seriously considering making that three of us!

Isn't this a bit weird if it increases the clockspeed for every preset other than flat and off?

I had the same problem with LAME, but files encoded using the Helix MP3 encoder play on the Shuffle, Nano and iPod Photo with no problems atall, this is at V 135 (equivalent bit rate to LAME V 1 --vbr-new). Even though it is still early days for testing the Helix encoder, I'm happy with the quality, and it saves me having to keep multiple copies of songs encoded at different bit rates for different players.

iPod nano stutters as bad as iPod mini 2G...

Just back from the shop, where I had a chance to test it with Five Years after and Right Where it Belongs.

Skipping/stuttering exactly the same as on the iPod mini 2G.

The nano EQ distort the sound as bad as the EQ on the mini.

To sum up the problem:
The stuttering will occur in specific locations on selected songs. A rough estimate is that less than 1% of songs will have this problem, but it depends on the music you have in your library.

If you want top sound quality either:
- don't buy Apple or
- don't use LAME aps

I wonder if using --vbr-new might prevent this problem? People have noticed that it doesn't produce as wide of a spread of bitrates.

Yeah I am very curious on whether 3.97b1 causes this issue on the Mini's and Nano's. I may have to do some fiddling around...

Nice to see someone figured out the cause of this. Good job!

I found this thread by google search, never been to the forums before, but i thought i should add my experience with the G2 ipod mini and LAME aps so far. Which is: ALL songs encoded with LAME aps skips in several places. Althought only a few skip noticeably like 'Right where it belongs'.

If only Apple would do an equaly good job and make one last fix for the world's best selling mp3 player of all time. But i suppose that is too much to ask for

EDIT: Not sure if it has been mentioned before, but i noticed that a sudden decrease in bitrate can make it skip too.

Hrmm is this problem only inherent in iPods or any other players that use the same PortalPlayer chips? Or is clock speed determined by the manufacturer as it seems to be linked to battery life (i.e. lower speed increase battery life). Also if possible could someone please PM me a link to the above files so I can test on my iRiver H10 (I didn't like the Nano so I bought the H10 instead ).


Regards

First post with links to samples

I feel so dumb! Dumber still I read the whole thread as well...

Hi,

I'm thinking of getting an iPod Nano. It has been mentioned somewhere in this topic that turning on the equalizer may fix the lame -aps "stuttering" problem. Can anyone confirm this? If this does solve the issue, is there anyway to have the equalizer turned on, yet set everything "flat" (so there is no actual change in sound)? And if so, does setting everything flat still resolve the issue?

From the original post...


Is this indeed the only way?

Thanks!

My initial tests have been pretty positive with 3.97x and -V2 --vbr-new. At least with the NIN song I don't hear the stuttering, whereas with 3.90.3 and aps I did.

I found skipping with the rock EQ on a Queens of the Stone Age Track. It wasn't 100% reproducible though, but about 5 in 10 it would still skip. Very Odd!

The Track in question is "Little Sister" of "Lullabize To Parralze", encoded with lame 3.96 -V 2.

I can't get it skipping the few times i tried this morning, but i was 50% reproducible on my long train journey home the other day.



Kristian

Hello to all Members,

I'm the new one and I only want to make a single post
I know the iPod mini 2G problem from the first second - I love EBM music and I think there are 10 percent of my songs which show this stuttering problem.

Okay... but today I think I have found a small solution. With your "_show_speed" instruction you gave me an idea: there are other options, too.
Please put another empty file in "/iPod_Control/Device/" but name it "_disable_cache". (It's possible to put more options than one at a time.)

Now the clock speed is only at 80 - the stuttering is away. But I don't know, if the battery time is shorter now or not!?

Please test it, I'm very excited to your opinion.

If it means that it doesn't use the onboard flash memory, then the battery would be much reduced

and also if it means this, then you are at risk from more micro drive faliure, as it will be reading all the time, leaving increased risk for head crashes etc.

Kristian

Yes, you are right. I have made a test with full battery - its lifetime was only ~5h now. That's similar to the iPod mini 1G.

Ehm... yes. What should I say? It's no full solution - but a small way.
Please, Apple, give us hope...

That seems so... I know

Any update on this issue?

My nano skips on many of my songs (not a majority, but enough to irritate the heck out of me)... I have all of my files (over 100GB of mp3s) encoded using LAME, and re-encoding is just not a viable option... I don't think I could stomach reripping that many CDs all over again!

Songs skip regardless of whether I use the EQ setting or not...

I am considering another iPod as a companion to my nano... Does this problem occur on the new iPods (with video capabilities)?

In any case, I am praying that Apple puts out a firmware fix for this issue, since I plan on keeping my nano, even if I get a new larger capacity unit... I would rather have less battery life with skip-free music!

Have there been any reports about Nano stuttering when playing iTunes AAC @ 128 kbps VBR?

AFAIK No

I'm quite honestly suprised they haven't fixed this, and I actually have faith they will (considering how far they upgraded the original 1G model's firmware, even though they still had most of the market back then)

They're obviously somewhat concerned with quality going by the progress on their AAC encoder. Apparently Steve jobs responds personally to email sent to him and I was going to ask him about it but I don't actually own an iPod since it got stolen so it hasn't actually affected me. Anyway it just seems strange. Have people been leaving them feedback about it or is the storm constrained to this teacup? Maybe they don't know, or don't realize how bad it is?

i was going to ask the same. i'm about to buy a nano, but i would have to buy an iAudio if LAME works bad.

EDIT:

- problem go away when using an EQ setting different from flat/off
- only safe EQ setting to use is Bass Reducer / Treble Reducer in order to avoid distortion of songs with a high recording level
- for the 4G color iPod only the sample with NIN - Right Where it Belongs stutters, even with the EQ set to Bass Reducer. Acoustic EQ setting makes the problem go away.

sorry for the question, but i'm yet to onw an iPod, does the Bass/Treble Reducer EQ settings change the music much? i mean, if that fixes the problem, why don't use it?