Hey there - I did a search but didn't find anything to help pre- or during- ripping and I don't have a choice over player. Apologies if this has been dealt with and I just missed it.

I've ripped using all sorts of codecs on Mediaplayer10, but no matter what, some tracks are distorting from clipping of volume peaks. I understand that volume on CDs these days is often too high for 'normal' MP3 encoding to deal with without clipping and that a lot of people suggest apps like MP3Gain, etc. does this mean on a portable player where I obviously can't use my own software that I'm doomed to endure badly clipped MP3s, or is there a ripper that will lower the volume before encoding so clipping doesn't happen?

Also, I have GBs of MP3s and I don't necessarily want to go through and re-encode them all from CDs (it would take a depressing number of hours!) does anyone know of a process (hopefully batch!) that would 'fix' clipped tracks and make them less painful to listen to?

Thanks lots and lots for any help!

First check if the clipping is already on the original CDs. If yes, you can't do anything about that.

EAC has a normalization function. Set it to below 100% and see if it works before the encoding happens.

Setting mp3gain to a low enough value (high negative gain) should usually work, because the encoding process doesn't clip away anything. The clipping happens on decoding. Works only with capable players/hardware, of course.

ps: "clipping from ripping" - that's an incorrect term, the ripping process itsself should be lossless

EAC? Sorry, what is that short for?

Sorry - I know I show my ignorance of the technicalities

As far as I know 'ripping' as the process of converting WAVs (or CDAs on a CD) to MP3 files on my harddrive. If that isn't 'clipping' the waveforms, does that mean my MP3 files are fine, but all the players I'm trying just can't cope with them?

EAC-Exact Audio Copy
http://www.exactaudiocopy.de/
At Hydrogenaudio there is consensus that this program and/or Plextools are the only two acceptable ripping tools, because they have error correction, what means they are able to deal with scratched CDs.

ripping-as far as I know this is only the process of converting *.cda to *.wav or other "official" lossless audio file, like *.aif for apple.
I hope my answers are OK for you.

edit:
I don't think so. If you rip with EAC and the clipping is still there, it's most likely the one from the original CD.

Your answers are perfect, thankyou!

Just tried MP3Gain and it's 'fixed' one file, and quickly too! Clever stuff to alter the levels without having to do any 'resampling' which is a term I am probably using incorrectly What I mean is it seems to fix the file without any loss of quality. Am I right that it does that? I'll go read further about it myself too, I guess

I'll try EAC later.

Thanks again for the top advice!

A question directed to the skilled users:
How bad is this encoding-clipping effect in general ? I doubt that it can be audible...

I'm not the skilled user you're asking, but, I just used Mediaplayer10 to make 192KBps MP3s of my new Tenacious D CD album and several of the tracks very audibly distort when loud parts play (the bass drum on Wonderboy is more of a crunch-crunch than a boom-boom). I listen to them on my PC using a the crappy motherboard onboard sound system and on my Archos AV480 and both give very audible (sometimes unbearable) distortion. The level meters on my AV480 player clearly showing clipping.

Bascially - it's very audible on a lot of the MP3s I've made and have been given (i.e. from quite a few sources).

The reason I have come to this forum now is that it seems to be happening more and more with 'modern' CDs. I think they are producing them at enormous gain levels to make their tracks sound louder on radio and MTV, maybe (again my ignorance may show in that opinion!). Isn't this a similar issue as adverts on the TV being ridiculously loud? If recording devices (and software) are optimised to play and record at a more 'normal' level, then the loud stuff will clip, no?

MP3Gain. A quick question if I may. It has a default Target 'normal' volume of 89. Is this a 'good' volume to use or is this a bit 'over-safe'?

Ok - sorry to be lazy - I've read the help and stuff with MP3Gain myself. What a great yet simple tool!

It tells you if any of the tracks will clip given the chosen volume setting - you can then alter the volume setting to be as high as you like per track or across the album and it will keep telling you if it'll clip or not so you can just lower the volume until it reports no clipping.

Nice!

Ok another question - I have looked for the answer, maybe not well enough, but here goes: -

Is there an equivalent to MP3Gain for .WMA files? Or, what is a good (free, lossless) way to convert .WMA to .MP3?

Thanks again again

There is no way to losslessly transcode between lossy formats.

<pedantic mode>
You can convert VP3 video files to Ogg Theora video losslessly, but you can't do the opposite. This is a special case, where Ogg Theora was designed to be that way.

In other cases, Defsac is correct.
</pedantic mode>

Oh. I'm surprised by that - maybe I am using 'lossless' in an incorrect way. What I mean is, will converting WMA to MP3 make the MP3 file lower 'quality' than the WMA?

Tricky question.

In a way, yes, it will always have potentially lower quality, for some definitions of "quality." Whether you can tell with your own ears is something only you can find out.

So in a way, no, it isn't always the case that you'll have lower quality. You'll have to take a listen to really find out.

Thanks for that. As long as noone thinks "OMG! No! Don't convert! It'll be awful!", I guess I'm happy converting from WMA to MP3 so I can use MP3Gain where I can definitely hear gain-clipping distortion and otherwise leave the WMAs alone.

[quote=precisionist,Aug 15 2005, 09:15 AM]
Setting mp3gain to a low enough value (high negative gain) should usually work

[/quote]Also, you can go into MP3Gain's options and turn on a feature called "max no-clip gain". This will show you just how much gain can be applied to MP3 files before they clip... or in the case of encodings made from most recent CD's, show you how much negative gain you need to apply so that they no longer clip.

[quote=precisionist,Aug 15 2005, 09:15 AM]
Works only with capable players/hardware, of course.

[/quote]No, actually. MP3Gain changes the "global gain" fields in the MP3's themselves. The MP3 remains technically identical to any other MP3, except that it is now quieter or louder.

[quote=elementalist,Aug 15 2005, 09:46 AM]
[quote=precisionist,Aug 15 2005, 02:33 PM]Clever stuff to alter the levels without having to do any 'resampling' which is a term I am probably using incorrectly What I mean is it seems to fix the file without any loss of quality. Am I right that it does that? I'll go read further about it myself too, I guess

[/quote]The word you're looking for is "re-encoding". And you're right, MP3Gain works its magic without re-encoding.

[quote=elementalist,Aug 15 2005, 10:24 AM]
MP3Gain. A quick question if I may. It has a default Target 'normal' volume of 89. Is this a 'good' volume to use or is this a bit 'over-safe'?

[/quote]If you're only working with very recent CD releases, then it probably is.

I, however, have run into plenty of situations where adjusting the MP3's to 89dB would still have them clipping. I have to take it down another notch or two for these. These mostly aren't albums though; these are radio recordings or movie soundtracks.

[quote=elementalist,Aug 16 2005, 06:56 AM]
Ok another question - I have looked for the answer, maybe not well enough, but here goes: -

Is there an equivalent to MP3Gain for .WMA files? Or, what is a good (free, lossless) way to convert .WMA to .MP3?

Thanks again again

[/quote]No. And it is impossible to losslessly convert WMA to MP3. It would be best to make new MP3's from the CD's. Otherwise, use Foobar2000 to convert from WMA to MP3 and accept that you will be losing quality.

It seems to me that you don't distinguish clearly between clipping on the original CDs and the one that may be caused by your processes (encoding or gain adjustment), sorry...

That "89dB" are 89dB SPL (sound pressure level) are quite confusing... I prefer to use the FS (full scale) scale. That means, 0dB is the maximum volume and -96dB is the minimum, positive values do not exist (16 bit audio CD system). In wavegain, the wav version of mp3gain, I'd choose a reference level -25dB to be save, what means there are 25dB headroom available for peaks above the average loudness.