so i did some stereo downmixes for radio and tv lately, but i just basically used my ears with some headphones and the end results will vary...

the input tracks are usually:
- preedited music (for certain lenght)
- off - speaker
- effects (usually multiple tracks)

i used eq to kinda separate the tracks by frequencies so i get kinda loud-enough mix with some compression usually applied to speaker and some small compression to the master mix itself.

q:
1. what is the usual effect to be used for widening the music (so i can center the speaker with ease - with less eq-ing that is) that wont sound cheezy?
2. what is the usual workflow?
3. what are some real standards to follow?

(p.s. not interested about 'loudness race' debate.)

also, what flat monitors should i get? (must be able to connect directly to soundcard output)

looking into this direction,
http://www.genelec.com/products/8020a/8020a.php

the 2nd option would be:
http://www.samedaymusic.com/product--YAMMSP3
(they provide unbalanced inputs as well as XLR)

any comments?

(or maybe what is the correct page/forum for this kind of questions?)

Genelec 8020A are very good. Don't know about the Yamahas, but they certainly look bad :-(

Funkstar De Luxe, yamahas look good as well (i saw them yesterday live, unfortunatelly i cant get them to sit on my desktop for a day or two...), well so far iam leaning toward yamahas, they come almost two times cheaper as genelecs as well..., also iam not sure how bad is pasive unbalanced 2 XLR connection (which is necesary for this genelecs), i could be looking for another investment if this wont work well, some sort of active mod could be needed...

on the other hand i did work with bunch of genelecs in the past and they rock.

edit: in yamahas case iam not sure how to mount them (or what stands to use for desktop - this is a small crowded room and iam facing the wall..., maybe just mount them on the wall somehow...?)

STEREO DOWN-MIX= If you are tweezing these track with DSP Plug ins, and trying to get more width, just be sure to periodically check your work by monitoring in MONO, to check for any surprise phase cancellation. The MONO button in one of my religions anyway, but I've been bit in the ass listening later to any artificial WIDE effects I've added.....be careful !

MID FIELD SPEAKERS= You mention the Genelecs. This company used to make speakers that I felt had very poor low end resolution, especially for the price point. The joy of any genelec for me, is a very smooth sounding tweeter in a smaller room, that doesn't bite my head off. That is a very hard to find characteristic, if that's your fancy. This company is clearly getting better at what they do all the time. Your mileage may vary.

Any POWERED Speaker design is usually much more linear than a separate amp, and speakers. Crossover, amps, and internal speaker wire is all calibrated as one complete system. I worry about the implications of the vibration upon the amp, but the accuracy of this approach is undeniable. Genelec did popularize this idea.

If you can afford the Genelecs, be sure to look at DYNAUDIO. The resolution and detail is fantastic. I'm still ticked off this company doesn't sell it's driver components separately to home speaker builders any more. It's really well designed stuff, IMHO. Very colorless. They will make you work hard ! Showing all your flaws in the audio........and then when you go home to listen.......YES......

Pick your speakers carefully. Find some way to audition them with your ears. Having good ones makes the work become effortless, and bad ones are a living hell. Spend weeks at a time placing them in the room till you find JUST the right spot. I think it may be the most important tool of them all in the studio. Besides the coffee maker.

turns out i cant afford genelecs, so yamahas will happen...., still not sure what stands to go for (wall fixed or just stands for this table.)



in my case is all about available space, there is just no space for separate amp....

edit:


hmm, that will be the next thing requested.

smok3, you mention a need for some good stands for your new monitors. Here's some other condensed advice about setting up speakers in your room. This is a KEY moment. Like I said, good playback is EVERYTHING !


My favorite cheap solution, is a large 5' monolith tower construction of hollow concrete cinder blocks. It looks like you are posting from Slovenia, so perhaps the word "cinder" is not understood......but unfortuately, I don't know what the term "Cinder blocks" stands for either.//*>*--. it's just what they call them at my local hardware store. Made from ash cinders originally perhaps? But basically concrete or masonry, but in hollow blocks. This is cheap, and is a very solid platform that doesn't move. Since they are usually hollow, it makes sense to stuff something inside as an absorber. You can just use a big can of putty to fix them together so they don't knock over, since they aren't supporting any walls or something, but instead, just hold the speakers. It will take two people, but as vertical stands, you can move them around to discover the sweet spot. You may want to use a smaller table, to enable this idea.

If the speaker hangs from above from a cable or chain, believe me, it will sound totally weird. This in fact proves why a firm base affects sound. Unlike a turntable, a total float just doesn't work. I think if hanging speakers worked, that's all anybody would do !! Same thing from a clamp directly to the wall, unless it's just for general listening, like in a resteraunt, it seems to screw it up.

A shelf can work, and the speaker sits on top, if it's a good one. The main problem is the sound being trapped underneath, and other acoustical effects from around the shelf. especially the back wall. Like an airplane wing, the objects around a speaker and near it, will change the sound, so just be aware of that. It also is usually tough to MOVE a shelf on the wall to experience and find your best speaker location. A long wide flat shelf might create all kinds of weird sound, but this will allow left right adjustment....I would probably not use a shelf myself.

I guess if you are in a very small room, and forced to be in the very nearfield to the speakers, then just one foot blocks to raise the speaker off the table to ear level will work. Table reflections are very bad, so be careful it doesn't color the sound. Speaker next to a back wall will get a bass boost, but your powered yamahas probably have an EQ switch to compensate right on board. Try to not be too close to the speaker when you mix, as the low end cannot develop, so you will mix to bass light, from not hearing any bass. I like 8 feet back. 2 foot is way too close, and even 3-4' seems unwise.....but hey, if it's a small room, so be it.


***FLOAT THAT SPEAKER!!== I really think this matters a great deal !! Audiophiles have used window glaze or putty, or pins, or cones, etc under the speaker since time began. All of these work to one degree or another, but my all time favorite is SORBOTHANE PADS. It's really amazing, but this makes the bottom end AND the entire speaker sound totally different ! More accurate, more pure, etc. The wieght of the speaker pushing down ensures a solid foundation and lack of front back movement, so the speaker sounds in focas. But the pads, (or other points of floatation) allow the box to resonate freely, in the way the BASS wants it too. It's like a guitar box in a way, if we didn't want a speaker to resonate at ALL, then we would make them out of rubber. The low end will breathe properly on dense pads. .

A speaker is heavy, so you will need big pads. I have them cut and calibrated for me, all of which is total over kill here.... so I suggest you get the product that has basically taken the idea, and ran with it. AURALEX, a company that primarily sells aucoustical foam for studios has a product several people I have met say they really like. It's the same concept as my Sorbosquares. I've Oooglely Googled it up for you here. They are called "MO-Pads"

http://www.auralex.com/sound_isolation_mop...ation_mopad.asp


This is about $40 US I think, and the physics is real, and I strongly suggest you get some for your yamahas. Think of it as part of the speaker price. I strongly suggest you take their free advice about sound treatments as well. They love to share this info. And no studio is to small for them. (But you can use pillows and layers of fabric too !!)

I'll even bet the store where you are getting your Yamahas from, has MoPads for sale. Music stores over here are selling them. And the bigger ones for guitar amps.

Then, you nead to acoustically treat the room. THAT is a huge can of worms, that would fill about 234232314231 posts !! However, in a real small space like it sounds like you cannot escape, prioritize these things>>


1-----Make it DEAD behind the speakers. It will feel weird at first.....but any reflections coming back from the wall, will blur what you hear in front of you. And bass build up is fatigueing too. Some use diffusion here, and diffusion usually works perfect for the BACK wall. But I like STONE COLD SPONGE on the wall behind the speakers. If there is a control room glass there.....then I guess just absorb AND defuse a lot. When I visit most studios, I'm called the interour decorator;; I like to hang a curtain over the glass. They laugh....yes...


2------SUCK UP THE BASS in the rest of the room in the corners. You won't hear it right away, but bass just likes to build up, and this is blurring things at all frequencys. So THICK foam, is always better than thin. Don't buy 1" foam, buy 3-4" foam and use less of it. Experiment.


A large COUCH / SOFA in the room behind the mixer is the ultimate DIY bass trap. If you have the space, do it. Or a Futon hanging on a wall, or a big roll or carpet in the corners. In general, you do not need to buy expensive foam, but instead, just don't absorb highs without lows at the same time, and it will probably work out fine.

Rawk on, and good luck !!