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boris_mikhaylov
I was realise software project called Bauer "stereophonic-to-binaural DSP" under GNU Library Public License.
Please see http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/
Compiled DLL for foobar2000 included in packege.
akku
I copied the dll into the foobar's components folder and I tried your plugin for a while. Just some initial impressions: it works (it takes the music away from my inner head) but affects the sound a bit. The sound is somehow veiled, I miss some ambiance informations (maybe high freq. roll-off?) and with some recordings the soundstage is really too narrow.
I built a DIY headphones amp with the cmoy crossfed and the effect is more gentle and it has less drawbacks.
I think such a plugin is going to be very useful for everyone listen music through headphones, is there any way to make parameters user selectable?
Keep up the good work!
Thank you.

(my first post at hydrogenaudio) smile.gif
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (akku @ Oct 28 2005, 05:14 AM)
The sound is somehow veiled, I miss some ambiance informations (maybe high freq. roll-off?) and with some recordings the soundstage is really too narrow.
I built a DIY headphones amp with the cmoy crossfed and the effect is more gentle and it has less drawbacks.


Yes, I know that Chu Moy's version is more preffered for some (may be most of) records. And I was make both Linkwitz's and Moy's versions by bs2b-convert.exe (see '-m' flag). I will make Moy's version in plugins by config window later.
Unfortunately, I has not hardware version yet, and I schedule to make Jan Meier's circuit, therefore I will glad to see comments about comparison of software and hardware versions and just a comments.
Thanks.
I will have compile Moy's version of fb2k plugin today and will post URL here ...just a moment.
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Oct 28 2005, 09:15 AM)
I will have compile Moy's version of fb2k plugin today and will post URL here ...just a moment.


done
http://www.tmn.ru/~bor/tmp/foo_dsp_bs2b-m.zip
fabiospark
I haven't tried anything yet so, if this request is silly just ignore it.

Feature request:

It would be the most useful if any DSP plugin could be enabled or disabled automatically by the content of a tag.

So, even when listening remotely from your PC (say, in bed) one could easily get the best setting for the playing track.

Of course there should also be a keyboard shortcut to disable it, enable it on track tag and enable it locked.
Storm
Only for 0.8.3?
foosion
QUOTE (Storm @ Oct 28 2005, 02:21 PM)
Only for 0.8.3?
*

Of course. Why do you think it would be for 0.9, if there is no public SDK for that. Or were you hoping for a version for 0.7? tongue.gif
akku
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Oct 28 2005, 04:35 AM)
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Oct 28 2005, 09:15 AM)
I will have compile Moy's version of fb2k plugin today and will post URL here ...just a moment.


done
http://www.tmn.ru/~bor/tmp/foo_dsp_bs2b-m.zip
*



I tried it and I like it. Ways better than the other version, IMO.
It reminds me of the hardware version but for a reality check I must connect another headphones amp to the PC.
Thank you very much for this plugin. smile.gif
ClassicalGasser
Thanks alot for this plugin! I listen to classical music at work on my IRiver with Shure E2s and none of the other crossfeed type plugins seemed to work well with classical.
A few questions:
1. When encoding to lame should I leave the bit depth at 24?
2. I also use vlevel before processing. Does volume level affect the effect?
3. Should I wait for the Meier version before rencoding all my music?
ssamadhi97
Why reencode?
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (ClassicalGasser @ Oct 29 2005, 11:13 PM)
Thanks alot for this plugin!  I listen to classical music at work on my IRiver with Shure E2s and none of the other crossfeed type plugins seemed to work well with classical.
  A few questions:
1. When encoding to lame should I leave the bit depth at 24?
2. I also use vlevel before processing. Does volume level affect the effect?
3. Should I wait for the Meier version before rencoding all my music?
*


1. I don't understand. All encoding is processed by double float inside bs2b.
And downbiting is done by external engine or audio formats only.
2. No, level does not affect the bs2b.
3. No, I mean of Meier hardware circuit that sound like Moy's version but is more simple RC circuit for high impedance input and output.

Note: bs2b just little down high frequencies level more by Linkwitz and less by Moy version cause of less by 3dB crosstalk of low frequencies by Moy's variant. Linkwitz's variant is more preffered if input stereo signal is less monoural in low frequency range, for example, if sound producer is mix bass viol in one channel only.
ClassicalGasser
Thanks for your reply. I noticed with deep bass pipe organ the effect wasn't as noticeable with the Moy version so I'll try the other as you suggest. So far I've encoded several hundred mp3s and the soundstage is greatly improved for most of them. Thanks!! biggrin.gif
dowxp
This is a good plugin, better effect than 4front headphones. I do find the highs lacking, or veiled (using moy version). will there be a configuration window later on? i like options ohmy.gif
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (dowxp @ Oct 31 2005, 11:59 AM)
This is a good plugin, better effect than 4front headphones. I do find the highs lacking, or veiled (using moy version). will there be a configuration window later on? i like options ohmy.gif
*


Yes, I intend to do configuration window, but not so quickly.
There will be only one option Linkwitz's or Moy's (extra -3dB crosstalk) variant.
dowxp
can you explain the -3db? what frequencies are affected? why the option? sorry for the Q's, not up in the theory.
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (dowxp @ Oct 31 2005, 12:16 PM)
can you explain the -3db? what frequencies are affected? why the option? sorry for the Q's, not up in the theory.
*


It well described at http://headwize.com/projects/showfile.php?file=cmoy1_prj.htm
see 'Figure 3' for quick refference.
All refferences are done in my documentation at http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/ or in bs2b package.
GeSomeone
I just want to mention that this plug-in needs MSVCR71.dll (you won't notice if you already have it smile.gif )
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (GeSomeone @ Oct 31 2005, 05:05 PM)
I just want to mention that this plug-in needs MSVCR71.dll  (you won't notice if you already have it  smile.gif )
*


oops :-)
Thanks, but why project files uses /MD compiling flag in fb2k SDK?
Should I recompile SDK and bs2b plugin with /ML or /MT or /MD like now?
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Oct 28 2005, 09:35 AM)
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Oct 28 2005, 09:15 AM)
I will have compile Moy's version of fb2k plugin today and will post URL here ...just a moment.


done
http://www.tmn.ru/~bor/tmp/foo_dsp_bs2b-m.zip
*



I has added two new test versions with high boost:
http://www.tmn.ru/~bor/tmp/foo_dsp_bs2b-h.zip
http://www.tmn.ru/~bor/tmp/foo_dsp_bs2b-hm.zip
Please comment it. If it usable I will add it to next configurable version.
dowxp
hmm, sounds like it should. no problems so far.
boris_mikhaylov
New version of bs2b at http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/

1.1.0b - test prerelease.
* Winamp2 plugin are unchanged and excluded from test package.
* Add high frequencies boost functions to bs2b library (see bs2b.h).
* Make less global gain against overloading.
* Add high frequencies boost option [-h] to bs2b-convert.
* Get out MSVCR71.DLL dependency from foobar2000 plugin.
* Create configuration window for foobar2000 plugin with options like -h and -m in bs2b-convert.
drbeachboy
Hi Boris,

Do the audio files need to be converted using the exe file before listening with foobar2000? Thanks!
Stratman
In the options screen, does selecting "Low crossfeed" select Moy's version?
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (drbeachboy @ Nov 2 2005, 11:11 PM)
Hi Boris,

Do the audio files need to be converted using the exe file before listening with foobar2000? Thanks!
*


No, just use plugin.
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (Stratman @ Nov 3 2005, 12:57 AM)
In the options screen, does selecting "Low crossfeed" select Moy's version?
*


Yes
GeSomeone
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Nov 2 2005, 05:36 PM)
1.1.0b - test prerelease.
[..]
* Make less global gain against overloading.
*

I don't think that was necessary in foobar2000, as in the DSP pipeline 64 bit floats are used, it won't overload easily. And now the volume is a little bit lower with the b2bs plugin than without.
Nevertheless, for me this is the best "headphone" plugin for foobar so far. cool.gif
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (GeSomeone @ Nov 23 2005, 11:31 PM)
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Nov 2 2005, 05:36 PM)
1.1.0b - test prerelease.
[..]
* Make less global gain against overloading.
*

I don't think that was necessary in foobar2000, as in the DSP pipeline 64 bit floats are used, it won't overload easily. And now the volume is a little bit lower with the b2bs plugin than without.
Nevertheless, for me this is the best "headphone" plugin for foobar so far. cool.gif
*


Thanks.
Floating point sound stream must be normalized to 1.0 value peak. That is why "diskwriter" plugin can be overloaded by bs2b plugin when it writes to integer wav file. bs2b do not make normalization of stream and diskwriter does not too.
I was add a little attenuation because a mathematical calculated global gain make overload in some frequency range with highs boost option.
I saw this by equal left and right sine signals (mono). I was prefer to make less global gain for all cases than make it due to bs2b options because this algebra is so difficult to me :-( and I think that this task have no solution.
pawelq
Dear Boris,

thank you so much for writing bs2b. I used to listen with headphones a lot, and always wanted to have a decent crossfeed plugin. The one built into foobar is not very good. I downloaded your plugin, and now I use it all the time. In particular, I am delighted how symphonic and opera music sounds. The soundstage is now very clear, the music is less fatiguing, the bass is sitting very well in the overall mix.
I started to recommend the plugin on some forums and I was quite surprised with sometimes not very enthusiastic responses. They were however caused by the gain reduction which you mentioned recently. People check the effects of the plugin by removing it from the DSP list and putting back while playing. What they notice immediately is that the music with bs2b is more quiet and they complain that dynamics is reduced. This is silly, and people who really can listen will appreciate the plugin.
But if you want the plugin to win popularity, I encourage you to tweak it in such way, that gain is not reduced.

Still, I want you to know that I am amazed and delighted. Thank you!
boris_mikhaylov
New 2.0.0b version of bs2b plug-in was released.
Sources and win32 binaries are available at http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/
Release notes:
* The new high frequency boost filter have implemented.
The old version of high-boost filter have been realized
by two-step recursive filter for computation power conserving
by subtraction of low-pass filter signal. The new method is
a one-step recursive filter. It has done to provide an adjusted
cut frequency value for more smooth frequency responce of
resulting signal.
* The new clipping feature by checking of [-1, +1] range of
double float operations have implemented against possible
overloads of signal level.
* Global gain have calculated from levels of low frequency range
like in first release. This is don't makes overload now due to
the new frequency responce and to the new clipping feature.
* New functions have added to library for various integer
audio data processing.
* New tuning method have implemented by three preset levels.
* Updatted Winamp 2 plugin have included to package.
Stratman
I'm trying to understand this new version. The old version allowed you to choose either Moy's or Linkwitz' crossfeed level. It also allowed you to choose a hgih boost or not.
The only control with this version is a three position slider for crossfeed level. What does each position equate to. Also, is the high boost built in?

Sorry for not understanding this but to my ears this is by far the best crossfeed plugin available so I'd like to continue using it.

Thanks.
neoufo51
Hope we get a version that works with the 0.9 release when it becomes stable.
david_dl
Whoa, I don't fully understand how this works, or really what it does, but after using it, listening without it is almost unbearable. "Getting the sound out of your head" is a very accurate description of its effect.

Thanks for your hard work.
markanini
This plugin is great! It actually makes the perception of the music better, other headphone plugins would do the opposit. Now I can't listen to music without it!

OT:I wish you could also develop a vst version of it, would be great for mixing with headphones.

I minor problem with v2.00b; I get some clicking, it's not very loud tho.
Overall v2 is a big improvment to prior version that I felt removed a bit too much treble. Keep up the good work! smile.gif
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (Stratman @ Mar 8 2006, 07:49 AM)
I'm trying to understand this new version. The old version allowed you to choose either Moy's or Linkwitz' crossfeed level. It also allowed you to choose a hgih boost or not.
The only control with this version is a three position slider for crossfeed level. What does each position equate to. Also, is the high boost built in?
*


The old version of bs2b, I was found, is not realy like Moy's or Linkwitz's versions. Because my old high-boost filter have more low cut frequensy. This is mistake of my mind that leads to more thick lowmids. The new version of bs2b is like Moy's version but not exactly.
I have done draft document. Please, see it at http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/about-draft.html
I will report to forum about release of comlete new manual.
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (neoufo51 @ Mar 8 2006, 10:24 AM)
Hope we get a version that works with the 0.9 release when it becomes stable.
*

Just give me a new SDK :-)
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (markanini @ Mar 8 2006, 08:51 PM)
OT:I wish you could also develop a vst version of it, would be great for mixing with headphones.
*

I will to try. Could you give me URL of VST SDK for C/C++?
http://www.kvraudio.com/wiki/?id=VST has dead URL to SDK
markanini
I have no clue about this stuff, but this link seemed to work: http://ygrabit.steinberg.de/~ygrabit/public_html/index.html
jlohl
QUOTE
OT:I wish you could also develop a vst version of it, would be great for mixing with headphones.


I did such a VST, try it at crossfeed+EQ

And let me know your results
markanini
Awesome! I'll have a look at it as soon as I have the time.
neoufo51
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Mar 8 2006, 11:44 PM)
QUOTE (neoufo51 @ Mar 8 2006, 10:24 AM)
Hope we get a version that works with the 0.9 release when it becomes stable.
*

Just give me a new SDK :-)
*


http://foobar2000.org/SDK.zip

0.9 was released. I would love to try out this component please.
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (neoufo51 @ Mar 19 2006, 09:06 PM)
0.9 was released. I would love to try out this component please.
*


http://bs2b.sourceforge.net/
2.0.0b2 - test prerelease.

* New plugin for foobar2000 0.9.
* Plugin for foobar2000 0.8 have removed.
* New look of configuration windows of plugins.
* Default coefficients of default middle crossfeed level and of
44100 Hz sampling rate was staticaly implemeted to bs2b library.
markanini
Thank You! smile.gif
jkml
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Mar 28 2006, 07:48 PM)
Default coefficients of default middle crossfeed level and of 44100 Hz sampling rate was staticaly implemeted to bs2b library.
*

Does that mean it is not appropriate to pass 48000 Hz audio to this DSP? Currently I am placing the resampler in front of bs2b... huh.gif
cybermantis
QUOTE
And there is SO MUCH in the music you dont normally hear. I just listened to Hey Jude from my Past Masters Vol 2 cd (for those of you who dont know, this is a compilation of singles) and --->

-->when listening at 3:14 you can make out the words "make it jude" and "jude jude jude wawawawawawaw" and all of the other stuff which were from alternate takes which you can hear in the anthology. You can see how the overlayed the tracks with it and its really cool! So much subtlty is exposed with this plugin - and it sounds great!
Ill try and find more examples as I come upon them.
randal1013
what is the bs2b plug-in?
randal1013
i dont understand. what am i supposed to do with the (.9) plug-in? when i add it to the playback DSP, all it does is muffle the music. it sounds like it turns down the mid-level freqs in the EQ, and the config options don't make a perceivable difference. am i supposed to have a certain kind of headphones or something?
markanini
If you dont find that it improves anything then it's not the plugin for you.
ev0|
Uh, I too need to know how to apply resampling (I resample to 48000Khz instead of letting my hardware do it) if this also resamples to 41Khz ? Should this go before resampling or after ? unsure.gif

In case you're unaware, the reason why people resample in foobar to 48000 Khz is because their hardware automatically does it, and foobar's resampler would do a better job. But I don't want to be having dsp resampling hell (41 Khz > 48 Khz(DSP) > 41 Khz (Baeur DSP) > 48Khz (Soundcard) ) would be bad for example.
boris_mikhaylov
QUOTE (jkml @ Mar 28 2006, 11:09 PM)
QUOTE (boris_mikhaylov @ Mar 28 2006, 07:48 PM)
Default coefficients of default middle crossfeed level and of 44100 Hz sampling rate was staticaly implemeted to bs2b library.
*

Does that mean it is not appropriate to pass 48000 Hz audio to this DSP? Currently I am placing the resampler in front of bs2b... huh.gif
*



It is mean that a user of bs2b library can bypass initialisation calls until he need to change crossfeed level or change sample rate in order to rate of audio samples.
It is no concern of plugin or converter users.
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