Hydrogenaudio Forums > Nero Releases FREE Reference Quality MPEG-4 Audio Encoder

jarsonic

May 25 2006, 06:29

QUOTE(wylistener @ May 25 2006, 08:24)

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ May 24 2006, 11:00)

We will issue a new update in the few days, which will among other things also include a command line tagger.

Will that commandline tagger enable the single mp4 feature such as CUE sheet, album art, etc? The feature stated in the first post of this thread is:

"* Store Entire Audio Album in a Single .mp4 File with all the Features of an Audio CD embedded inside, but at a fraction of the space!"

Signs point to yes. But, as always, wait for a dev to say anything before you take that as fact.

AstralStorm

May 31 2006, 14:21

Great codec. Vorbis can't come close even with latest aoTuV mods until about
-q -1 vs -q 0.2. Then it's a tie.
I mean that audio at 11kbps is even fairly listenable.
(unlike some Garf's experiments with Vorbis at lowest bit rates)

Are SBR+PS responsible for such good results?

I wonder which one's better at higher bit rates, like ~160 kbps. (or Vorbis -q 5)
Probably neither...

Do you have even more up your sleeve?

torok

May 31 2006, 15:37

QUOTE(AstralStorm @ May 31 2006, 13:21)

Great codec. Vorbis can't come close even with latest aoTuV mods until about
-q -1 vs -q 0.2.

Ivan Dimkovic

Jun 1 2006, 06:41

New Version (1.0.0.2) is out, get it from:

http://www.nero.com/nerodigital/eng/down-ndaudio.php

QUOTE

Version Number: 1.0.0.2

Release Date: 18/05/2006
New Features:

* neroAacTag.exe for Nero Digital Audio Tagging
* Nero AAC Encoder
- Now writes mpeg-4 tags at the beginning of the MP4/3GP files
- Now supports multiple input files (-if) and produces a multichapter
MP4 file when more than one input file is present
- Backwards compatible signalling of SBR and PS Audio Object Types
(also when LC is used for encoding) for improved 3GPP
Compatibility
- Added progress display
* Nero AAC Decoder
- changed to new faster AAC/HE-AAC/HE-AAC v2 decoder
- Added support for the backwards compatible signalling and
corresponding behaviour

Version Number: 1.0.0.0

Release Date: 01/05/2006

jarsonic

Jun 1 2006, 06:45

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ Jun 1 2006, 08:41)

New Version (1.0.0.2) is out, get it from:

http://www.nero.com/nerodigital/eng/down-ndaudio.php

QUOTE

Version Number: 1.0.0.2

Release Date: 18/05/2006
New Features:

* neroAacTag.exe for Nero Digital Audio Tagging
* Nero AAC Encoder
- Now writes mpeg-4 tags at the beginning of the MP4/3GP files
- Now supports multiple input files (-if) and produces a multichapter
MP4 file when more than one input file is present
- Backwards compatible signalling of SBR and PS Audio Object Types
(also when LC is used for encoding) for improved 3GPP
Compatibility
- Added progress display
* Nero AAC Decoder
- changed to new faster AAC/HE-AAC/HE-AAC v2 decoder
- Added support for the backwards compatible signalling and
corresponding behaviour

Version Number: 1.0.0.0

Release Date: 01/05/2006

...and there we are.

The features of the new tagger should be interesting and very, very useful.

wylistener

Jun 1 2006, 07:04

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ Jun 1 2006, 07:41)

New Version (1.0.0.2) is out, get it from:

http://www.nero.com/nerodigital/eng/down-ndaudio.php

QUOTE

Version Number: 1.0.0.2

Release Date: 18/05/2006
New Features:

* neroAacTag.exe for Nero Digital Audio Tagging
* Nero AAC Encoder
- Now writes mpeg-4 tags at the beginning of the MP4/3GP files
- Now supports multiple input files (-if) and produces a multichapter
MP4 file when more than one input file is present
- Backwards compatible signalling of SBR and PS Audio Object Types
(also when LC is used for encoding) for improved 3GPP
Compatibility
- Added progress display
* Nero AAC Decoder
- changed to new faster AAC/HE-AAC/HE-AAC v2 decoder
- Added support for the backwards compatible signalling and
corresponding behaviour

Version Number: 1.0.0.0

Release Date: 01/05/2006

So how do I use the neroAacTag.exe commandline tagger to enable the single mp4 feature such as CUE sheet, album art, etc? The feature stated in the first post of this thread is:

"* Store Entire Audio Album in a Single .mp4 File with all the Features of an Audio CD embedded inside, but at a fraction of the space!"

Ivan Dimkovic

Jun 1 2006, 07:12

- You can feed encoder now with multiple PCM WAV files (check out the release notes) - output will be the multichapter file

- You can then use the tagger to set the metadata, and optionally also add cover art in the file (front/back cover, etc...)

Please check the command line tool's help.

.halverhahn

Jun 1 2006, 07:49

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ Jun 1 2006, 14:41)

New Version (1.0.0.2) is out, get it from:
http://www.nero.com/nerodigital/eng/down-ndaudio.php

Hvala lepo!

Wedge

Jun 1 2006, 08:10

Thanks a bunch for this. Any plans(date) for a linux binary?

wylistener

Jun 1 2006, 09:12

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ Jun 1 2006, 08:12)

- You can feed encoder now with multiple PCM WAV files (check out the release notes) - output will be the multichapter file

- You can then use the tagger to set the metadata, and optionally also add cover art in the file (front/back cover, etc...)

Please check the command line tool's help.

But feeding it multiple files doesn't make sense. I take CD, rip it to a single WAV+CUE. I now have ONE single 500mb WAV file that has an associated CUE sheet that shows where all the track points are.

What you're saying is I need to split my single WAV file into separate WAVs per song and then feed that back into neroAacEnc.exe with the new “-if” option. And then I have to write some customer parser (C program, PERL, whatever) to parse the CUE file for “TRACK” and “INDEX” meta and feed that to neroAacTag.exe?

torok

Jun 1 2006, 09:37

QUOTE(Wedge @ Jun 1 2006, 07:10)

Thanks a bunch for this. Any plans(date) for a linux binary?

Have you been able to get NeroAacTag to work with Wine? I just get a "Could not update MP4 file" error.

Maurits

Jun 1 2006, 09:44

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ Jun 1 2006, 13:41)

- Now writes mpeg-4 tags at the beginning of the MP4/3GP files

Ivan Dimkovic

Jun 1 2006, 09:51

Yes, direct cuesheet parsing is a good idea - it will be added in the next revision.

QUOTE

Have you been able to get NeroAacTag to work with Wine? I just get a "Could not update MP4 file" error.

We will look into this - Linux Version is also coming soon so I guess that will be a native solution for it.

binkgle

Jun 1 2006, 11:20

when encoding with eac, do i direct the encoder to neroaacencoder_sse2.exe or neroaactag.exe if i want tagged m4a's? same question for foobar, i guess...

jarsonic

Jun 1 2006, 11:55

QUOTE(binkgle @ Jun 1 2006, 13:20)

when encoding with eac, do i direct the encoder to neroaacencoder_sse2.exe or neroaactag.exe if i want tagged m4a's? same question for foobar, i guess...

Neroaactag.exe doesn't encode, it only tags.

LaserSokrates

Jun 1 2006, 12:52

My Settings in EAC for encoding and tagging with nero are:
user- defined encoder, file ending .m4a
Program used:

CODE

C:\Windows\system32\cmd.exe

additional commands:

CODE

/c C:\path\to\neroaacenc.exe -q 0.425 -if %s -of %d && C:\pat\to\Neroaactag.exe %d -meta:artist="%a" -meta:album="%g" -meta:track="%n" -meta:title="%t" -meta:genre="%m" -meta:year="%y"

You might want to change the paths according to your personal preference

kwanbis

Jun 1 2006, 14:32

just updated MAREO (4.0.1 now) to include the configuration option for the tagger.

Waterfall

Jun 1 2006, 14:40

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ May 11 2006, 13:56)

If that is of any help, our PNS and IS powered modes at 64 and 80 kbps are done, and they have been sent to tuning process

So expect maximum squeeze of LC-AAC for those bit-rates in the next couple of weeks

Ah, I've been waiting for this release!!! Sadly, I can only play LC-AAC on my portable

What switches do I use to encode at these powered modes?

And which switches should I use with -lc to get the best results?

torok

Jun 1 2006, 14:52

Does the new tagger set iTunes-style in addition to Nero tags? If so, does it duplicate data in the Nero tags, or only use the Nero tags for the meta-data that can't be held in iTunes tags?

binkgle

Jun 1 2006, 15:35

QUOTE(LaserSokrates @ Jun 1 2006, 14:52)

My Settings in EAC for encoding and tagging with nero are:
user- defined encoder, file ending .m4a
Program used:

CODE

C:\Windows\system32\cmd.exe

additional commands:

CODE

/c C:\path\to\neroaacenc.exe -q 0.425 -if %s -of %d && C:\pat\to\Neroaactag.exe %d -meta:artist="%a" -meta:album="%g" -meta:track="%n" -meta:title="%t" -meta:genre="%m" -meta:year="%y"

You might want to change the paths according to your personal preference

thx, i'll give it a shot

ssjkakaroto

Jun 1 2006, 16:51

thx a lot for the update nero team!

any particular reason for this change Ivan?

QUOTE

-Now writes mpeg-4 tags at the beginning of the MP4/3GP files

al_iguana

Jun 1 2006, 17:00

thanks to the Nero team, this gets better and better, and is now my encoder of choice.

for the tagging in EAC, i would use -meta:track="%n/%x" which gives track 02/11 etc (at least in Foobar. Track number/of doesn't show up in iTunes for some reason). Tagger is very fast, and very welcome

torok

Jun 1 2006, 17:17

QUOTE(torok @ Jun 1 2006, 08:37)

QUOTE(Wedge @ Jun 1 2006, 07:10)

Thanks a bunch for this. Any plans(date) for a linux binary?

Have you been able to get NeroAacTag to work with Wine? I just get a "Could not update MP4 file" error.

Nevermind. It's just because Wine won't let an app modify a file that's outside of the Windows sandbox. I'll have to look into that.

dano

Jun 1 2006, 17:25

QUOTE(al_iguana @ Jun 2 2006, 01:00)

for the tagging in EAC, i would use -meta:track="%n/%x" which gives track 02/11 etc (at least in Foobar. Track number/of doesn't show up in iTunes for some reason). Tagger is very fast, and very welcome

You should use -meta:track="%n" and -meta:totaltracks="%x"

Creature

Jun 1 2006, 23:01

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ Jun 1 2006, 18:41)

New Version (1.0.0.2) is out, get it from:
http://www.nero.com/nerodigital/eng/down-ndaudio.php

I'm just encoded file with new neroaacenc... neroaacenc.exe -q 0.425 -lc -if xxx.wav -of xxx.m4a
CoolEdit recognized xxx.m4a as a AAC-HE and it's sounded like a average AAC-HE...
I'm think it is a side effect of "Backwards compatible signalling of SBR and PS Audio Object Types
(also when LC is used for encoding) for improved 3GPP Compatibility"... but why it's affect the playback quality of winamp/cooledit?

limbo

Jun 2 2006, 01:09

QUOTE(Creature @ Jun 1 2006, 21:01)

QUOTE(Ivan Dimkovic @ Jun 1 2006, 18:41)

New Version (1.0.0.2) is out, get it from:
http://www.nero.com/nerodigital/eng/down-ndaudio.php

I'm just encoded file with new neroaacenc... neroaacenc.exe -q 0.425 -lc -if xxx.wav -of xxx.m4a
CoolEdit recognized xxx.m4a as a AAC-HE and it's sounded like a average AAC-HE...
I'm think it is a side effect of "Backwards compatible signalling of SBR and PS Audio Object Types
(also when LC is used for encoding) for improved 3GPP Compatibility"... but why it's affect the playback quality of winamp/cooledit?

...and I've just discovered that the new version produces .m4a that my Shuffle won't play, whereas previous version with the same settings did. This evening I'll try experimenting with the command line switches and tagging to see if it makes a difference. Can anyone else with a Shuffle verify this? I tried various -q and used the recommended command line settings for foobart2000.

i000

Jun 2 2006, 02:45

QUOTE

...and I've just discovered that the new version produces .m4a that my Shuffle won't play, whereas previous version with the same settings did. This evening I'll try experimenting with the command line switches and tagging to see if it makes a difference. Can anyone else with a Shuffle verify this? I tried various -q and used the recommended command line settings for foobart2000.

will check it ASAP, but first try running mp4creator -optimize *. m4a (get it at rarewares.org). the shuffle won't read files which have the tag data at the end.

Which version of foobar did you use to produce your files? foobar2000 0.9 does tagging when converting but it attaches them to the end

Marcin

limbo

Jun 2 2006, 04:52

QUOTE(i000 @ Jun 2 2006, 00:45)

QUOTE

...and I've just discovered that the new version produces .m4a that my Shuffle won't play, whereas previous version with the same settings did. This evening I'll try experimenting with the command line switches and tagging to see if it makes a difference. Can anyone else with a Shuffle verify this? I tried various -q and used the recommended command line settings for foobart2000.

will check it ASAP, but first try running mp4creator -optimize *. m4a (get it at rarewares.org). the shuffle won't read files which have the tag data at the end.

Which version of foobar did you use to produce your files? foobar2000 0.9 does tagging when converting but it attaches them to the end

Marcin

I'll try it this evening. I'm using 0.9.1, which is what worked with the previous version of the nero encoder. (I should just mention that iTunes displays and plays the files fine.) I'll also try encoding without foobar, to see if it is causing the problem.

I'm keen to get this working, because the Nero encoder sounds excellent to my ears.

Squeller

Jun 2 2006, 06:20

I've never seen such a brilliant progress display before

Anyway, I like the codec, the results have surprising quality and, imporatnt to me: Searching is extremely fast.

menno

Jun 2 2006, 08:23

QUOTE(Creature @ Jun 2 2006, 07:01)

I'm just encoded file with new neroaacenc... neroaacenc.exe -q 0.425 -lc -if xxx.wav -of xxx.m4a
CoolEdit recognized xxx.m4a as a AAC-HE and it's sounded like a average AAC-HE...
I'm think it is a side effect of "Backwards compatible signalling of SBR and PS Audio Object Types
(also when LC is used for encoding) for improved 3GPP Compatibility"... but why it's affect the playback quality of winamp/cooledit?

Old FAAD2 just reads that info incorrectly, nothing to worry about, the file is LC

limbo

Jun 2 2006, 14:47

QUOTE(i000 @ Jun 2 2006, 00:45)

QUOTE

...and I've just discovered that the new version produces .m4a that my Shuffle won't play, whereas previous version with the same settings did. This evening I'll try experimenting with the command line switches and tagging to see if it makes a difference. Can anyone else with a Shuffle verify this? I tried various -q and used the recommended command line settings for foobart2000.

will check it ASAP, but first try running mp4creator -optimize *. m4a (get it at rarewares.org). the shuffle won't read files which have the tag data at the end.

Which version of foobar did you use to produce your files? foobar2000 0.9 does tagging when converting but it attaches them to the end

Marcin

Marcin, you're brilliant! mp4creator -optimize did the trick. I'll go that route. Out of interest, I noticed that with the "unoptimized" files, that the Shuffle would finally play each one after a pause of several minutes. Not sure why the shuffle needs to read the tags, since it has no where to display the info.

binkgle

Jun 2 2006, 17:42

QUOTE(binkgle @ Jun 1 2006, 17:35)

QUOTE(LaserSokrates @ Jun 1 2006, 14:52)

My Settings in EAC for encoding and tagging with nero are:
user- defined encoder, file ending .m4a
Program used:

CODE

C:\Windows\system32\cmd.exe

additional commands:

CODE

/c C:\path\to\neroaacenc.exe -q 0.425 -if %s -of %d && C:\pat\to\Neroaactag.exe %d -meta:artist="%a" -meta:album="%g" -meta:track="%n" -meta:title="%t" -meta:genre="%m" -meta:year="%y"

You might want to change the paths according to your personal preference

thx, i'll give it a shot

this isn't working for me, i get a message saying that the external compressor returned an error. any ideas on why this might be?

skelly831

Jun 2 2006, 18:28

QUOTE(binkgle @ Jun 2 2006, 16:42)

this isn't working for me, i get a message saying that the external compressor returned an error. any ideas on why this might be?

Are you typing yuor paths correctly?, if your paths to the encoder and tagger have spaces (like having C:\Exact Audio Copy\neroaacenc.exe), you need to put the whole path in quotes.

binkgle

Jun 2 2006, 19:32

QUOTE(skelly831 @ Jun 2 2006, 20:28)

QUOTE(binkgle @ Jun 2 2006, 16:42)

this isn't working for me, i get a message saying that the external compressor returned an error. any ideas on why this might be?

Are you typing yuor paths correctly?, if your paths to the encoder and tagger have spaces (like having C:\Exact Audio Copy\neroaacenc.exe), you need to put the whole path in quotes.

there we go, that was the issue. thanks so much

Creature

Jun 2 2006, 20:41

QUOTE(menno @ Jun 2 2006, 20:23)

Old FAAD2 just reads that info incorrectly, nothing to worry about, the file is LC

Not just info, faad decoded & new neroaacdec decoded raw pcms differs by values... That values can't be described as a round errors... and this difference audible for me (at least @ -q 0.5), MP4 created by neroaacenc v1.0 and decoded by old&new neroaacdec and faad tied within acceptable round errors... I don't understand why bring this.. "signalling" thing for AAC-LC... iTunes properly encoded & decoded AAC-LC, mono as a mono, stereo as stereo without any "signalling". Why not use more compatible way for this like a Apple did?

fanbanlo

Jun 2 2006, 23:44

help... I'm trying to convert WMA -> WAV -> AAC by piping ffmpeg -> nero's CLI encoder...

I tried with nerodigital 1.0.0.2, and here's my result.:

CODE

C:\ffmpeg>ffmpeg -i INPUT.wma -acodec pcm_s16le -f wav - | neroaacenc_sse2 -q 0.
28 -ignorelength -if - -of output.mp4

FFmpeg version CVS, Copyright (c) 2000-2004 Fabrice Bellard
  configuration:  --enable-theora --enable-mp3lame --enable-libogg --enable-vorb
is --enable-faad --enable-faac --enable-xvid --enable-x264 --enable-mingw32 --en
able-a52 --enable-dts --enable-pp --enable-gpl --enable-memalign-hack --enable-a
mr_nb --enable-amr_wb
  libavutil version: 49.0.0
  libavcodec version: 51.1.0
  libavformat version: 50.0.0
  built on Jan 29 2006 03:34:22, gcc: 4.0.2
Input #0, asf, from 'INPUT.wma':
*************************************************************
*                                                           *
*  Nero Digital Audio Reference MPEG-4 & 3GPP Audio Encoder *
*  Copyright (C) 2006 Nero AG                               *
  Duration: 00:41:10.4, start: 0.608000, bitrate: 20 kb/s
  Stream #0.0: Audio: wmav2, 22050 Hz, mono, 20 kb/s
Output #0, wav, to 'pipe:':
  Stream #0.0: Audio: pcm_s16le, 22050 Hz, mono, 352 kb/s
Stream mapping:
  Stream #0.0 -> #0.0
*  All Rights Reserved Worldwide                            *
*                                                           *
*  Package build date: May  1 2006                          *
*                                                           *
*  See -help for a complete list of available parameters.   *
*                                                           *
*************************************************************
[color=red]ERROR: could not parse WAV file[/color]
size=  106376kB time=2470.0 bitrate= 352.8kbits/s
video:0kB audio:106376kB global headers:0kB muxing overhead 0.000040%

Problem with piping? 'cause I tried:
> ffmpeg -i input.wma -f wav temp
> neroaacenc_sse2 -q 0.28 -ignorelength -if temp -of output.mp4

and it works... Nero's problem or XP's piping problem?

Thank you.

dummptyhummpty

Jun 3 2006, 04:33

Sweet! This was worth the wait. I've got it working except how do I set the iTunes compilation filed to true or false? I tried -meta-user:compilation="true" or ="false" but that did not work. Any ideas? Thanks!

dano

Jun 3 2006, 04:44

-meta-user:itunescompilation=1

dummptyhummpty

Jun 3 2006, 04:52

QUOTE(dano @ Jun 3 2006, 03:44)

-meta-user:itunescompilation=1

Thanks! And 0 for if it is not one?

i000

Jun 3 2006, 05:07

QUOTE

Out of interest, I noticed that with the "unoptimized" files, that the Shuffle would finally play each one after a pause of several minutes. Not sure why the shuffle needs to read the tags, since it has no where to display the info.

It does not, the big ipod also does not read tags, everything is stored in db files, but The shuffle knows which track it is playing - you can sync it with last.fm via amarok (i do it that way). If you are using iTunes there is also a problem with streaming back-tagged m4a files. When you are on windows use tag&rename to tag your files it's the only one working for me. On linux no solution (exept tagging and optimizing)

btw. does anyone know a method to optimize so it does not change its creation time (mp4creator does it through a temp file) i need it because amarok rea-dds optimized files to your collection.

dano

Jun 3 2006, 05:36

QUOTE(dummptyhummpty @ Jun 3 2006, 12:52)

QUOTE(dano @ Jun 3 2006, 03:44)

-meta-user:itunescompilation=1

Thanks! And 0 for if it is not one?

If it's no compilation then the field should not be used at all or removed, but maybe setting it to zero has the same effect.

QUOTE(i000 @ Jun 3 2006, 13:07)

It does not, the big ipod also does not read tags, everything is stored in db files, but The shuffle knows which track it is playing - you can sync it with last.fm via amarok (i do it that way). If you are using iTunes there is also a problem with streaming back-tagged m4a files. When you are on windows use tag&rename to tag your files it's the only one working for me. On linux no solution (exept tagging and optimizing)

btw. does anyone know a method to optimize so it does not change its creation time (mp4creator does it through a temp file) i need it because amarok rea-dds optimized files to your collection.

Mp3tag v2.36 now also puts the atoms at the beginning and it also has the optimize feature.
It should also keep the creation time.

sven_Bent

Jun 3 2006, 09:04

The chapters support is just wonderfull.

but as someone mentioned. it would be nice to be able to rip into on .wav and then refer to the cue sheet for th chapter info.

wouldn't that also be more precise regarding where to put the chapters points ?

How does chapter support work in winamp ?

torok

Jun 3 2006, 22:25

Here's a little writeup I did on getting this all to run under Linux, including ReplayGain:

http://pkulak.com/articles/18

Waterfall

Jun 4 2006, 11:23

Is it possible to write into .3gp with this encoder?

Teetrinker

Jun 4 2006, 12:33

QUOTE(Waterfall @ Jun 4 2006, 18:23)

Is it possible to write into .3gp with this encoder?

Use MP4Box after encoding.

>MP4Box -add neroAacEnc.mp4#1 out.3gp

sven_Bent

Jun 4 2006, 12:46

is there a way to make it use more cpu pwoer to improve quality.

psytell encoder once had such a switch believe it was -production

beacuse wit the speed it as nowm i would gladly pay up to 50% more encoding time for a "5-10% more quality"

Also SMP support ?

AstralStorm

Jun 5 2006, 18:18

QUOTE(sven_Bent @ Jun 4 2006, 20:46)

is there a way to make it use more cpu pwoer to improve quality.
psytell encoder once had such a switch believe it was -production
beacuse wit the speed it as nowm i would gladly pay up to 50% more encoding time for a "5-10% more quality"

Don't even mention that antique. ;-)

It's not easy to trade CPU power for better encoding. The only thing off the top of my head is using better, slower quantizer and having a variety of them, like LAME.
Anything else is just tuning and won't use more CPU.

AtaqueEG

Jun 6 2006, 18:42

QUOTE(sven_Bent @ Jun 4 2006, 13:46)

is there a way to make it use more cpu pwoer to improve quality.

psytell encoder once had such a switch believe it was -production

beacuse wit the speed it as nowm i would gladly pay up to 50% more encoding time for a "5-10% more quality"

Also SMP support ?

Use a higher setting, and ABX.

audioflex

Jun 7 2006, 23:03

why is PNS non activated still?

G B Rao

Jun 9 2006, 07:00

Given a file encoded with the Nero encoder, is it possible to find out which version of the encoder was used to encode it ?