I'm a novice EAC user. I'm ripping new to barely used CDs.

After EAC extracts the wav (copy image and create cue sheet, uncompressed), it gives user opportunity to review "range" and perform "glitch removal".

So far on 2 CD rips, the glitch removal process identifies and removes ~1000-5000 total glitches for both sides.

From listening comparisons, I cannot discern a difference between glitch-rich and glitch-free wav files.

So, does the EAC glitch removal help, or hurt, or make no difference.

I am concerned more with the quality than time involved, within reasonable limits.

Thanks in advance for any help.

If your discs barely have any scratches you should be fine using a Test & Copy in Burst mode. Then you can compare the CRC's from both rips, and if they match, you have a prefect copy.

I miss a button called Test & Copy Image, but works around it by ripping twice and compare the two CRC's manually.

I have not used the glitch removal tool, but I'm 99.99% sure that this is a lossy process, since it's done after the rip.

If you rip single tracks you may also have a look at AccurateRip, which compares CRC from your ripped tracks with an online database.

That's an overly excessive amount of glitches for a new or barely used CD. It could very well be a problem with either the drive you're ripping with or your EAC configuration. How long did it take for EAC to rip one of these CDs?

I used Liekloo's Essential Guide when I was getting stated with EAC, and I've been a very happy ripper ever since.

The third and fourth CDs yielded only 100-300 glitches total.

I think it took about 14 minutes to rip a single, ~50 minute play time CD. I have the C2 error checked as the EAC detection process indicated my lite-on dvd/cd drive had this capability.

Nice link, i'll dig into that guide later.

Get rid of this!! Many drives report false C2 errors. I believe this is also used as a copy protection scheme sometimes.

>Many drives report false C2 errors.

In the contect of EAC, if a false c2 was flagged then EAC will move on to its re-rip phase on that section, without c2 - so the use of c2 will not introduce more 'glitches' than if it was switched off.

on my teac-cdw540e i had to disable c2-usage to get propper rips

>Many drives report false C2 errors.

Isn't it usually the other way around, the phenomenon that EAC doesn't perform re-rips because CU errors can go overlooked (whether it be the fault of the drive or EAC's interpretation of what the drive is telling it)?

Have you ever gotten matching T&C CRCs for a bad rip with C2 and 100% track quality with this drive?

Yes, but there where glitches. I think the drive is wrongly indicating a successful c2-correction...

Perhaps not with 100% track quality, but yes

100% track quality is the critical item here, since as spoon already mentioned, C2 isn't used during re-rips.

Now, what's wrong with Burst T&C on clean disks??? I just ripped my entire collection, and GOD I'm glad I skipped the C2 hell. It would often just stop and re-read the disc even if not nessesary

Nothing is wrong with Burst T&C on clean discs. I can also understand not wanting to use C2 for copy-protected discs where error correction has been compromised. If used properly, Secure with C2 can offer a compromise between speed and the ability to catch and correct errors, especially with a non-caching drive or a drive that accepts the FUA command.

The dark horse (of course, of course), is the possibility of consistent errors and in what modes they occur, which is what I was asking about.

seeker333, if you're having trouble with copy-protected discs do try odyssey's recommendation, and also use a version of EAC that allows you to access the native TOC and/or try a different drive. New discs shouldn't give you such problems unless they are defective.

Thanks for the replies.

However, I still have my original question basically unanswered.

Should I be using the "glitch removal" feature when I'm extracting a complete CD as a single wav file with cue sheet.

I can't find much info on the subject anywhere. It is not clear to me what a glitch is, and less clear if it should be included in a ripped archive intended to be eventually compressed to mp3 V2 -vbr-new format.

All I know for sure is that I can't hear a difference with or without the glitches.

Evidently the author of EAC thinks glitches should be removed under certain conditions, since this feature is included. However, it is not explained when this feature should be utilized (or at least I am unable to find the explanation in any documentation).

You should really be trying to identify the cause of your high # of glitches and eliminate that, rather than trying to figure out how you'll deal with them.

With new/clean discs, a decent drive, and properly configured EAC, you shouldn't be getting any glitches (unless your discs are copy-protected, but this was already beaten to death). I've ripped around 35 discs so far with my new Lite-On LTN-4891S - zero glitches, all matching CRCs with the AccurateRip database.

A glitch are the "ticks" you hear when you try to play a badly scratched CD - They may be more or less auidible, but EAC may also be confused to think there are glitches when there arent. When you see EAC reports that many glitches (on a clean disc) and you can't hear them, I doubt that it's actually a glitch!

A glitch can't be removed, but it can be masked (by EAC or various sound editing software). That's why this progress is lossy - It's up to you if you want to use it or not, but I know for sure - I WOULDN'T!

I think the question you ask here is how you make sure your rip is proper - That's why I tell my own experience in the first post above. You should check the CRC value - try ripping the disc again and see if you get THE SAME VALUE!. If you do, you can disregard ANY errors in the log, but if you want to put some effiency into your progress, you should try selecting Burst mode instead, because this could often rip a disc in less than 5 minutes. If you choose the Burst mode your only reliable source for checking the rip is the CRC, but this is the mode i've had the best results with.

A way to see and hear the difference would be to import both the files (de-glitched and non de-glitched) into Audacity, invert one of the files and then mix both. You’ll be left with a file that is the difference between the two.
You can analyze that info how you would like, or just play the file to hear the difference.

1. I'm using eac v0.95 beta 4. There is no selection under "action" labelled "burst mode". So, I don't know what "burst mode" is....

2. On 4 different CDs i have run the "test and copy" mode, CRCs on maybe 55 tracks are OK.

3. I have glitches on all 4 of these CDs. On one they number in the 200s. On another in the 5000s. In the past (2005), when I was using eac v0.95 beta 3 i used this "glitch removal" feature regularly. It usually detected glitches to some extent. I don't recall a CD with zero glitches.

4. I'm using a lite on xxx1693 model drive.

5. I don't hear any clicks or any other anomalies in these CDs . They're 1960-1970 vintage that I have listened to for many years, so I'm familiar with the tunes. Obviously a glitch IS NOT an clear, audible popping sound.

6. None of these CDs appear to be scratched. I expect 1/2 are practically brand new, played less than 5x on a home cd player only.

Inverting and mixing the waveforms will show any differences and allow you to hear then independent of the actual signal (the song itself) and let you know if they are just small differences that are being drowned out (made imperceptible) by the signal.

If glitches are something that wouldn’t show up in the waveform, what in earth might they be ... and why on earth would they be a concern?

Burst is an Extraction method which can be found in "Drive options" (F10). Alternatively you might just try to turn off C2 - Try ripping using eigher method and see which suits you at best.

I'll answer this first - YES a glitch by it's definition is usually audible! But if EAC tells you theres a glitch and you can't hear it, who would you believe?

A rip should not at all contain glitches, and the way I believe is the most reliable way to tell this is by matching CRC's, since a rip with different CRC's would contain glitches - audible or not.

Personally i've got the LiteOn LTR-48246S - The fastest and best optical drive to read scratches with i've had yet.

Then you should definately be able to gain matching CRCs - Go for that, and forget everything about glitch removal - You rip is exactly simelar to the source!

I've seen matching CRCs for tracks ripped in error in Burst mode, Secure mode with C2 and Secure mode without C2.

The most reliable way to tell if a rip is accurate is to use AccurateRip.

Again, considering the condition of seeker333's discs, I do not belive there were any errors to worry about.

@seeker333:
How do you know that you have errors that need correcting?

I just loaded a perfectly ripped track verified by AccurateRip into EAC's wave processor and instructed it to de-glitch. It corrected over 3000 glitches. My advice like everyone else's: don't use (or put your faith in) EAC's de-glitching routine.

I'd like to see that!

Although I have found what I think is a bug in EAC, which shows the previous CRC if the rip contained no samples - This has confused me a few times, and maybe what you are discovering.

It isn't.

I'm sending you a PM.

Yes, but unfortunately it doesn't check image CRC's!. I've thought of a workaround to rip all tracks verified by accuraterip and splicing them afterwards, but that would be incompatible with INDEX 00 on track 1 in cue sheets...

You can rip to a wave image, mount the image and then use AccurateRip to check the mounted image. I've done this many many times.

No the extended pregap isn't checked, nor are the first 5 frames of the first track or the last 5 frames of the last track, but so what. We're talking about silence or close to silence in 99+% of all cases.

But I'm not trying to scare anyone here, I put my faith in Burst T&C; but I don't kid myself into thinking that this is concrete proof of an error-free rip.

greynol - what's the procedure you use (as well as the tools)?

-brendan

I'm unable to force AccurateRip to check the CRCs on the virual drive created with Daemon Tools

I only know the tool "Deglitch" and it very often finds glitches in perfectly ripped disks. This is the nature of these tools. It only looks at the waveform and reports a glitch when it looks like a damage.
Many transients in music or most electric sounds like in techno music will be seen as glitch.
May be interesting what kind of music is reported with the high glitch count.
If EAC has a similar deglitch engine it doesn´t surprise me at all.

So applying a deglitch when no obvious ripping errors occur simply changes the original content. This may do some harm in a way.

I think you are right. EAC's "glitch removal" is simply evaluating for a specific waveform transition, then interpolating to a flatter transition. Apparently the transitions occur over such a short time span that you don't really hear them (or miss them when deglitched).

I agree, it's probably better to not use the "glitch removal".

This makes me wonder why EAC has you jump through all the hoops to achieve a bit-perfect rip, then gives the user the option at the end to go through and arbitrarily modify the file with a completely unexplained "glitch removal" tool. Also makes me wonder under what conditions this feature would be useful.

The button is there for when you get a suspicious position. It allows you to review the areas and perform glitch removal.

Don't take this the wrong way, but you decided on your own to jump through hoops; 'cause if you ask me pressing F6 and looking for a "#" is in no way jumping through hoops.

After all this explanation you still believe EAC reports more than experienced users and suggestions? IMHO you should stick with another ripper.... like WMP or something