Hey all, I've joined this forum hoping I could get some information/recommendations/advice on various PC audio input hardware devices. I'm in the market for one, so I have a few questions before I make any purchases. First of all:

These usb/firewire interfaces convert the analoge input to digital (to travel through usb/firewire). Is this to say, then, that they will take the place of an onboard soundcard for any signal processing? For example, If I were to record, edit, and produce a song with recorded sources using one of these devices, it should function with or without a soundcard, correct? That is, it's completely independent of any audio device currently in my system?

Thanks in advance.

yes

There are some differences between PCI and external soundcards, however. Leaving gaming and multi-media soundcards out of the discussion entirely, most, if not all, internal soundcards have on-board DSP that allows mixing the new input with playback of previously recorded tracks. Almost all multi-track recording software lets you play existing audio files as you record something new. With the PCI card's mixing ability, you can easily synch the new tracks to the ones you already have on the computer.

This facility does not exist in external soundcards. Many have ‘direct monitoring' capabilities which let you hear your current input, but no mixing facilities to allow you to record in time with previous tracks.

Some recording software has the ability to output the new input as it is recorded, much like a three head tape deck, but no all programs can do this. Thus, if you have an external soundcard, and your recording application does not provide for direct monitoring of the input, you must rely on additional hardware, an external mixer, for complete monitoring. In order to use that external mixer, the external soundcard must support direct hardware monitoring.

How important all this is depends on what you want to do and what software you want to use to do it, but many people have been disappointed to find that their purchase does not allow them the flexibility to easily do what they expected.

Sorry about the delay, I've been busy with schoolwork.

So what you're saying is that the direct monitoring feature only plays back the audio that is currently being recorded? And that if I have either an imported audio file or a recorded track in my sequencer, the Direct Monitoring will not play them back?

Are theses units essentially external soundcards with built-in inputs?

That is what I'm afraid of; I want to be sure I won't be disappointed later on.
What I'm loooking for is some way to record instruments and incoming audio signals onto my computer (in a software mixer). I figured devices such as the Edirol FA-66 (an others in its class) would provide the simplest method of getting that stuff into a sequencer. However, if direct monitoring is not going to let me hear the tracks I'm recording against, that will not suffice. Is there an alternate solution you could recommend?

Thanks for your time.

As I tried to say in the first post, you need to match your needs, your software, and your soundcard.

[A] If the recording application you want to use allows real time input monitoring/mixing, then you don't need that facility in the soundcard; you can get by with an external soundcard and no hardware mixer.

[B] If you want an external soundcard and want to use software that does not do real time input monitoring, you need
(1) a full duplex external soundcard (common) to play back the existing tracks through its DAC while recording the new ones through its ADC
(2) direct input monitoring in the external soundcard to monitor the new input that is going into the ADC
(3) a hardware mixer (separate device in most cases) to mix both (1) and (2) before sending the signal to the speakers.

[C] You can use a PCI soundcard, even a multi-channel one where the converters are in an external box. These have DSP mixing that lets you monitor the new input mixed with playback of existing tracks.

If you do multi-track recording, each source to a separate track, you will have a great deal more control over your final product. This can be done with a multi-channel soundcard, if you are creating several different things at the same instant, or with a basic two channel soundcard if you can get by inputting only one or two things at a time. Both approaches are common. Nothing gets mixed (in any permanent fashion) until everything is recorded and each part tweaked to be exactly what you want.

I'm sorry, but I'm having a bit of difficulty understanding. I haven't decided on a final DAW sequencer yet, but it will support real time input monitoring/mixing. Given that both the software application and the external soundcard will support real time input monitoring/mixing, what will my limitations be? If I have a project with a few pre-recorded tracks, will I be able to hear them through the output while I record a new track? Simultaneous multichannel recording is not a necessity at this time.

DAW used to stand for digital audio workstation, which meant a computer optimized for audio production, maybe including recording. It was possibly independent of the software to be used on it, but in some cases (especially Pro Tools systems) had hardware selected for best results with some particular software. What do you mean by DAW?

In (A) I am referring to recording applications, of which there are many. Some of them can use the CPU (plus RAM and whatever other resources are involved) to do digital mixing of the input with tracks they are currently playing back, alleviating the need for hardware DSP (normally available in a PCI soundcard). Do you mean that you will not consider a recording application that does not do this? If so, then there isn't any question of it being available. It therefore doesn't matter what soundcard you use, as long as it is full duplex (can fully utilize recording (ADC) and playback (DAC) simultaneously). The majority of professional soundcards are full duplex.

As I said a couple of times, external soundcards do not "support real time input monitoring/mixing." Well some do, they have a hardware mixer and soundcard built into one box, therefore you don't need a separate mixer. They are not representative of the majority of external soundcards. If you mean that you intend to obtain such a soundcard, then you will have the monitoring facility, regardless of what your recording application does.

"If I have a project with a few pre-recorded tracks, will I be able to hear them through the output while I record a new track?" That is what "real time monitoring/mixing" is. It can be achieved in any of the three ways I outlined.

Sorry, my mind was elsewhere; I meant [software] 'sequencer'. I've edited my previous post accordingly.

I am fairly new to digital audio recording, so thanks for bearing with me. It sounds as if I will not be limited (as far as real-time monitoring goes) as long as my software supports real-time monitoring/mixing and my external soundcard is a full duplex device or my device is both a hardware mixer and external soundcard, and I plan on satisfying each of these two conditions.

Given that, are there any software sequencers or recording boxes you might be able to recommend to me?

‘Software sequencer" says midi. I don't do midi, so I am not a reasonable source of information.

This site purports to address the questions you asked
http://www.tweakheadz.com/catalog-sequencers.htm
and I'm sure there are many others.

Using midi can mean producing audio from either hardware or software. Hardware means external devices, things further out beyond the computer than the soundcard/interface. Software might mean your recording software, but there are also a lot of other soft synthesizers.

Midi I/O is very common on soundcards. Only gaming cards, such as Soundblasters, have synthesizer chips on the soundcards, to produce audio from midi. The others, the great majority, only pass midi instructions through from the outside (e.g. a midi keyboard) , to be received and used by software, or from software to the outside to be used by midi hardware devices.

These two threads go into some detail. You might find something useful there. The site itself is not very oriented to midi use however.
http://www.audiomastersforum.net/amforum/i...pic,1306.0.html
http://www.audiomastersforum.net/amforum/i...pic,1144.0.html

Thanks for the links.

Midi is not my primary focus, I also intend to record from external analogue sources (recording instruments, etc). As far as Midi goes, however, I'll be using both external hardware (midi controllers/synthesizers) and Softsynths (Reason).

I've been getting great results using an M-Audio Fast Track Pro with Reaper as my DAW software. Most (if not all) external soundcards designed for studio recording support some form of direct monitoring, and the interface you mentioned (Edirol FA-66) does have this facility.

Reaper also allows for monitoring what you're recording and does play all the existing tracks at the same time. This has advantages and disadvantages. The advantages are that you can apply effects to the monitored input so, for example, the vocalist can have reverb on his/her monitored vocals. The disadvantage is that latency will be involved, although this shouldn't cause a problem unless you have a fairly slow computer or wish to use high latency or CPU heavy plugins.

Buy the Edirol, and Reaper (well worth the $40), and you'll be fine.

Thanks for the additional info, danbee.

I've been reading into the Edirol FA-66, and so far it seems like a decent product. I know Edirol is a subsidiary or Roland; is this a good name in Audio Interfaces? Also, this device advertises both Hardware Direct Monitoring in addition to Software Direct Monitoring. Latency aside, what advantages does one have over the other?

At this point, both the Edirol FA-66 and the M-Audio FireWire 410 are capable candidates. Does anyone have any insight that would help me decide? Have I missed/overlooked anything? Do you know of a better product in the same price range?

Thanks again.