After tagging .wav's and then burning the files to make a cd-a, why aren't they showing up as being on record? What's missing here?

Your CD does not match the factory pressed CDs and they never will. What you can do is rip it about 4-5 times and then submit the results to AccurateRip. It should then show up in AccurateRip a little later. I have a CD that I made myself (I actually made the music) and it is the only copy on earth. I have ripped it quite a few times so now the CD is in AccurateRip's database.

Not only would you need to submit it multiple times but on multiple systems. But what would be the point? A consistent read error on your disc would give you the false impression that you had a perfect rip, and it would take up space in the database that is useless to anyone else.

So is it best to turn accurate rip off when ripping custome made CD's?

Defiantly!!!

Is that similar to definitely ? And also, are you really mad ?

Don't you mean definitely?

There really isn't any harm in submitting results from custom made CDs other than wasted space on Spoon's server.

Just don't delude yourself into thinking that your rip is accurate (or the source used to create one of your custom CDs) just because AR says so.

ok, so i made my cd, ripped it few times on different machines, and now i wanna rip it on machine #N, why would there be any problem? (this is just theory, i wouldn't really do that, since i have the source files anyway...)

This may significantly improve the odds that there wasn't a ripping error from the CD-R, but it doesn't say anything about the accuracy of the source tracks used to make it.

Diversity of hardware is a good thing when it comes to ripping, but I think having multiple original copies of the same pressing is no less important; probably more important.

This should theoretically work, however all you are doing is proving you are getting as good of a rip as possible from the burnt CD-R. It is entirely possible that there are errors on the disc that are being read the same way N times and are being confirmed in AccurateRip.

One of the advantages of using AccurateRip to check commercial discs is that there are several copies of the source CD being copied (from different people around the globe), so not only does it rule out errors in the reader, it also rules out errors on specific disc, which may be repeated N times by numerous re-reads, even with different drives.

1/ Don't spell too good, sorry.
2/ In one of the threads Spoon was concerned about the size of the data base when he expands it's capability. Filling it with junk. is not going to help. If too many people do it, it could even jeopardize the whole project.

Sorry for any misspellings in advance!

Link please (emphasis mine).

Nonsense.

I have a suggestion that might work out well for verifying self made audio CDs ...

Why not simply make it a CD image first ?

- mount that image as virtual drive
- rip it a couple of times and check if CRC values are consistent
- burn it physically
- rip that physical disk a couple of times and compare CRC values to the ones from the virtual CD

if all CRCs are matching perfectly, submit to AccurateRip DB and FreeDB

Any objections ?

Maggi

AccurateRip automatically puts people who submit from any sort of disc image on a 'ban list', their results never make it to the database and any previous results are purged.

Thanx for feedback, Spoon.

So my method could only be used internally (privately) for verifying if a custom burned CDs is in good shape, right ?

To verify your CD-R was burned properly and will extract correctly?

Sure, though the idea to use AR for this was ill-conceived.

You would be better off using the CRCs generated by EAC since the checksums created by AR do not provide as much coverage, not to mention that entries for custom discs serve no purpose to anyone (it doesn't seem like this point has gotten across).

The third post to this thread by pdq sums this all up perfectly.

Note: The server was being unresponsive as I was editing this. Once it came back two replies had already been posted.

sure ...

Just use the burning programm of your choice and instead of physically burning it onto CD, make it a disc image on your harddrive as eg. .iso, .nrg, .cue + .bin etc.

then you could mount that image as a virtual drive and it'll show up as audio CD

when ripping that image for generating CRC values, you can easily rule out read errors from scratches, jitter or whatever problems might occur when physically burning CDs, thus you can use it to compare to the final physical master CD

here's more info: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Optical_disc_image

or am I missing something completely here ?

Cheers,
Maggi

Hmm, while I agree that disc images should not be kept in accurate rip, I think that banning someone for submitting a rip of an image is pretty harsh...

Particularly since there is no user control over which individual rips are submitted!!!

(unless both EAC and dba automatically ignore image rips and people try to submit them manually or via some other unsupported app)

oh my ... your editing makes it really hard to answer all the questions you asked ...

I was about to post that my suggestion to rip the image multiple times (even on different machines) would be the only way to make it show up in the AR database, but since Spoon clearly stated ripping images is unwanted and prohibited, it surely is a no-go and therefore a single "extract and test" pass in EAC would be sufficient for getting reference CRCs values





sorry for the confusion ... I was indeed speaking of the CRC values of EAC that could be used to verify, if a burned audio CD is in perfect shape compared to the virtual image

The use of AR in that context would have been just a second, but publicly available entity for verification

Admittedly, there wouldn't be too many people benefitting from submitting such custom CD AR values to the database, but recently I converted quite a few analog tapes from live recordings of my brother's band, which were recorded in the mid 80s and mastered those onto CD and if those custom CDs would have been stored in the AR DB, it would be an easy mean to verify if a copy is still in good shape. Especially since he is living in another country than me and shipping data carriers through customs can result in unwanted side effects at times (eg. x-ray examinations of packets)

...

I hope my point is a little clearer now.

Cheers,
Maggi




I read that post and therefore I concluded it would be more safe and more accurate to rip an image instead, prior to ripping the physical audio CD

Nevermind, I got the point and won't submit any AR results neither from ripped images nor from custom made audio CDs.

Maggi

It's never a bad idea to verify your burn against the source. You just need to make sure to take offsets, overreading, and overwriting into account.

Thanks for the clarification. Sorry about the edits.

That's an interesting point. Has anyone seen any data on the effect of x-rays on CDR?

No prob, Greynol ...

but to be honest, I'm not sure how I could safely find offsets, overreading and overwriting for virtual discs ... I guess, I'd need to make an image of the offset test cd from EAC and mount it as virtual drive, rip it again and compare the CRC values to the ones from the real test cd ... would that work or would it interfere with offsets from my burner ?

at least the ones that I burned had matching EAC CRCs with the mounted and ripped virtual image




Not on digital media yet, but a few years ago he sent me another MC and that one sounded odd when it arrived, somewhat mouldy and a little wavering.

I admit, it's heart to tell the exact reason for the loss of sound quality, but on the phone he said it was sounding ok when he sent it. The last batch of tapes had a disclaimer "do not x-ray - magnetic tapes" and those came in fine .... maybe it was just an incident, dunno.

Harddrives should be shielded well by their casing, but I consider optical storage media more sensitive to external influences.

It is the burner's abilities that need to be taken into consideration. If it has a write samples offset of zero (some drives do) or your drive is capable of overwriting (few do) then you have nothing to worry about for the burn. For the subsequent read you might run into overreading issues if your drive is not capable.

You need to make sure to include null samples for CRC calculations in order to be sure that the data on the copy is not offset. If the samples that are in the area to be overread or overwritten are null then this won't be an issue.

This is the standard problem that people have when comparing rips between different drives that have different offsets and/or overreading capabilities. It usually results in a different CRC for the last track because most drives have a negative read offset.

Thanx for the advice, Greynol ... I'll have a look into it.



Maggi