I'm in the middle of re-ripping all my CD's to alt preset standard. They used to be encoded with -r3mix. I've been noticing that some people are concerned about the increased average bitrate with aps compared to r3mix. Anyone interested in me posting my results when I finish encoding my collection? It's about 1750 tracks, from soundtracks to metal to techno to jazz & a little classical. I'd like to also post the results from my original -r3mix encodes from 4 months ago for comparison.

Of course! I've been waiting for someone to do something like that! In fact, I was thinking of starting a big database where people can report the sizes of all the albums they encode.

The only problem I can forsee is how to differentiate between which version of --alt-preset standard you are using. (There are 2 different compiles which give different encoding sizes)

I'm using 3.90.2. I know there's a 3.91 floating around, but I don't use "fast standard" so I didn't see the point. Actually, I rarely rip whole albums, only the songs I want (that JVC mp3 head unit in my car is nice ), so I don't think just listing the CD's would be helpful...should I just list the individual tracks with their respective r3mix and aps bitrates? I should be done in a few weeks.

PS - So far I've been getting a range of 185 to 205 kbps...not too bad...it'll probably only add up to maybe just an extra CD or two that I'll have to put in the car...


To be more precise, I'm using 3.90.2 - ICL compile

Yeah, this would be interesting. Not being a codec guru the bitrates tend to confuse me. Stuff I'd think would be hard to encode (Einstürzende Neubauten, for example) averages around 150-160 kbps with -aps, while stuff I'd think would be easy (pop music) often averages around 220. In fact when encoding Ende Neu by Einstürzende Neubauten, it encoded one track ("The Garden") almost entirely in 128 kbps. I suppose it knows better than I do though. =P

Using alt preset standard (and the msvc compile) I got an avg. bitrate of 190 kbps (based on 28 CDs). Range (bitrate of complete CD) was between 220 kbps (Tower of Power) and 168 kbps (Harry Connick Jr. - Jazz).

Best regards,

Wilfried

Hi, is it possible if you post the list of the CDs and their corresponding average bitrates? And if you have the time, try encoding them with --r3mix and obtain the average bitrates too. Thanks a lot

Hi tangent,

please find attached the information about the encoded CDs:

Bernard Purdie - Soul To Jazz: 197,6 kbps
Björk - SelmaSongs: 184,2 kbps
Bobby McFerrin - Spontaneous Inventions: 180,1 kbps
Cannonball Adderley - mercy, mercy, mercy: 192,7 kbps
Cassandra Wilson - Traveling Miles: 184,9 kbps
Dr John - Anutha Zone: 192,5 kbps
Fiona Apple - When The Pawn...: 184,6 kbps
Freundeskreis - En Directo (2 CDs): 188,4 kbps
Gil Scott-Heron - Spirits: 186,9 kbps
Graham Central Station - Graham Central Station: 192,2 kbps
Harry Connick, Jr - Blue Light, Red Light: 168,8 kbps (min)
Harry Connick, Jr - Star Turtle: 196,8 kbps
Mardi Gras BB - Big Brass Bed: 199,4 kbps
Mardi Gras BB - live im Capitol: 186,1 kbps
Mother's Finest - Live: 180,0 kbps
Nils Landgren - Ballads: 175,2 kbps
Nils Landgren Funk Unit - 5000 Miles: 200,4 kbps
Nils Landgren Funk Unit - Fonk Da World: 182,7 kbps
Nils Landgren Funk Unit - live in Stockholm: 189,7 kbps
Nils Landgren Funk Unit - Paint It Blue: 200,2 kbps
Randy Newman - Little Criminals: 184,3 kbps
Sheryl Crow - The Globe Sessions: 186,5 kbps
Sly And The Family Stone - Fresh: 180,6 kbps
The Dave Bruback Quartet - Time Out: 187,8 kbps
Tori Amos - Strange Little Girls: 180,5 kbps
Tower Of Power - Back To Oakland: 200,2 kbps
Tower Of Power - Soul Vaccination: 220,1 kbps (max)


I can't spend the time (in the near future) to encode them with r3mix and I doubt that it makes sense to compare those encodings only by size (r3mix for example had problems to encode the voice on some of the tracks at Nils Landgren - Ballads CD and the Fiona Apple CD properly...).

Hi tangent,

just for the record the bitrates of aps vs. r3mix:


Artist --alt preset standard / --r3mix
Bernard Purdie - Soul To Jazz: 197,6 / 180,2 kbps
Björk - SelmaSongs: 184,2 / 167,5 kbps
Bobby McFerrin - Spontaneous Inventions: 180,1 / 153,1 kbps
Cannonball Adderley - mercy, mercy, mercy: 192,7 / 179,4 kbps
Cassandra Wilson - Traveling Miles: 184,9 / 162,0 kbps
Dr John - Anutha Zone: 192,5 / 173,0 kbps
Fiona Apple - When The Pawn...: 184,6 / 163,3 kbps
Freundeskreis - En Directo (2 CDs): 188,4 / 167,2 kbps
Gil Scott-Heron - Spirits: 186,9 / 165,7 kbps
Graham Central Station - Graham Central Station: 192,2 / 171,6 kbps
Harry Connick, Jr - Blue Light, Red Light: 168,8 / 139,5 kbps (min)
Harry Connick, Jr - Star Turtle: 196,8 / 176,6 kbps
Mardi Gras BB - Big Brass Bed: 199,4 / 187,7 kbps
Mardi Gras BB - live im Capitol: 186,1 / 157,8 kbps
Mother's Finest - Live: 208,6 / 197,6 kbps
Nils Landgren - Ballads: 175,2 / 161,8 kbps
Nils Landgren Funk Unit - 5000 Miles: 200,4 / 187,8 kbps
Nils Landgren Funk Unit - Fonk Da World: 182,7 / 162,6 kbps
Nils Landgren Funk Unit - live in Stockholm: 189,7 / 170,5 kbps
Nils Landgren Funk Unit - Paint It Blue: 200,2 / 185,1 kbps
Randy Newman - Little Criminals: 184,3 / 149,3 kbps
Sheryl Crow - The Globe Sessions: 186,5 / 169,4 kbps
Sly And The Family Stone - Fresh: 180,6 / 159,7 kbps
The Dave Bruback Quartet - Time Out: 187,8 / 172,1 kbps
Tori Amos - Strange Little Girls: 180,5 / 159,3 kbps
Tower Of Power - Back To Oakland: 200,2 / 175,5 kbps
Tower Of Power - Soul Vaccination: 220,1 / 209,8 kbps (max)

Total playing time: 24h 10min 34s, avg bitrate: 190,5 / 171,2 kbps

I just finished the encoding. The final numbers are as follows:

#of tracks: 1809
Total Length: 124 hours, 46 minutes (449,160 seconds)
Avg Bitrate: 181.673 kbps

This is for alt preset standard. I'll post the numbers for r3mix shortly. Should I break these numbers down by the type of music or what? To be honest this number is lower than I thought it would be...oh well, so much the better

breakdown by album should be fine, thanks

Ok I'll do this for my Rainbow Remasters - 80 files.

I've just encoded them on -F -r3mix to stop <96 kbps. Does aps use any frames less than 128, even for digital silence? Basically I dont want real low bps for hardware players.

Also, what program should I use to generate a list of bits rates.

Initial results - file size ratio of first 15 tracks.. r3mix:aps ~ 104:109

Does EncSpot work on an album?
I believe aps will still use 32kbps frames for digital silence.

I post the results by album soon, along with the r3mix results...sorry, but I've been busy lately and it may take a while.

Yes, aps does use 32bit frames for digital silence, I tested it. I'm including a -F which stops this now, so all is >=128 (by the looks of it .

Here are the files sizes for my Rainbow Remasters, 80 tracks in all.



So I guess aps is about 6% more than r3mix (in this case).