I had a topic open last week where I was trying to find out how to do multiple simultaneous inputs, outputting them to separate WAVE files, using my on-board sound and a multi-channel program like Traverso-DAW. You all have said that I can't do it with the on-board sound.

So, I was thinking as an alternative... could I install a few inexpensive sound cards and do multi-channel input that way? I would use the on-board sound for the output, as well as use one of its inputs.

Also, could I get 3 channels off each card by having 2 for the line-in, plus another 1 for the mic, or would there be significant pitfalls to also using the mic input?

I like to do most of my computer parts shopping at NewEgg, but if you can suggest someplace else (preferably if they have (a) card(s) you'd recommend that's not carried at the egg, fire away. I'm looking at some of the ones in this newegg link ... and would like to keep them in that price range, although I'd be willing to probably double that for one that supports 4-channel inputs for example. I won't consider any that are rated less than 3/5, and will only consider a 3/5 one if it's likely that the one or two reviewers got lemons, or if you guys would otherwise recommend that particular card.

My mobo has 2 PCI slots, 3 PCI Express x1, 1 each x4 and x16, all of which are currently available (although I'm going to want to put a video capture card in one (or maybe two) of the slots. The mobo is a Gigabyte GA-MA69G-S3H - onboard audio is Realtek ALC889A.

So what would you suggest? I've searched Google a little and have gotten conflicting results about whether or not multiple audio cards can be used at the same time. Many of the posts are a few years old, though, and most of them say they cannot be used as multiple outputs simultaneously, but don't say anything about multiple simultaneous inputs.

Why do you want multiple inputs? Are you going to multi-track a band?

I am asking this because your budget seems to be at odds with the scenarios you'd need multi-track inputs. Multiple inputs requires multiples of other equipment as well, eg microphones, mic-pre amps/a mixer, cables, stands etc. Your budget doesn't seem to cover any of that.

Also multiple cheap cards will gives a lot of crappy sound, perhaps it is better to stick to stereo input with a better quality card.

I doubt any cheap sound card has with a line input and a mic input that can be used simultaneously. The reason there are 2 physical inputs is the analogue electronics requirement for microphones is different than the requirements for a line signal. There will be 1 stereo A/D converter, that can be used for either the mic input, or the line input, not both.

I guess you could say that, but not a rock / pop / country "band". It will be mostly choral vocal with piano, occasionally other instruments, like guitar (possibly 2), possibly a lead instrument like violin, clarinet, etc (but those aren't likely to be used with the vocals, although they could be). I'd like a few channels for the vocals - 2 or 3, maybe 4 for a choral group (and in a quartet or smaller each would have their own mic), stereo for the piano, and mono for each other instrument. This may not exactly add up, but let's see... 2 channels for the piano, 3 for the vocals, 3 each for extras... that'd be 8 channels, which would be 3 cards plus onboard, or 4 cards (disabling onboard or using onboard for monitoring only). I probably could bump up to 10, 12 or even 14 (or 16) channels by adding a couple extra cards, but I'd like to leave a couple slots open on my mobo for other non sound cards I might get in the future.

My dad has a couple mixers I could use (one's a Mackey - forget the model # off hand, other's a Ramsey which I probably won't use). Also we have a few mics (most expensive of which is a $50-80 (forget exactly) Sennheiser), and I have a Zoom H2, which I'll probably use at the piano.

The price I quoted above for what I'm looking at is only for the sound cards (for each card), and doesn't include other equipment. Ok so I'll just 2 channels per card. More expensive cards are not within my budget at all, unless they have multiple input capability. I don't want to spend more than $75-100 total on the cards, and would like to have at least 8 channels of input (although MAYBE I could make do with 6). That budget doesn't include extra mixers and things, though. I definitely am not going to be spending big bucks, though - probably tops of $30-40 per mic, $10-15 per stand (unless the cheapest ones are more expensive than that in which case the budget would go up a bit), you get the idea. This is an extreme budget scenario. As far as the quality for the sound cards goes, I just want it to be at least as good as the on-board Realtek ALC889A, which IMO is plenty good for what I'll be using it for.

The person who normally does the recording of this may not be there, and my budget has about 2 or 3 too few 0's to be able to buy equivalent equipment to what he has. (I hope I'm not needed to do it - hope someone else does it, but I want to be available as a backup.)

I was thinking the same thing, but I figured it was none of my "beeswax"... A Shure SM57 or SM58 on each channel, and you're into a few hundred dollars already.

Good idea! The best compromise is probably to use a mixer and record to 2-channels at a time. And, you will have to compromise... Most of us do... I think it would cost about as much as a (new) compact car to build a home studio good enough to produce a CD. Do you have a good recording space? This kind of music requires a good space.

In a good room, you might actually get the best results with a simple stereo-pair of microphones. The trick is to get the mics at the right distance to get a good, natural, blend of direct sound and room reverb. From what I've read, some of the best classical, orchestral, recordings have been done with a stereo pair.

I don't know if you can use multiple soundcards to get multiple channels. But, you'd probably need to run a separate copy of your recording software for each stereo channel. If that assumption is correct, you'd have to click Record and Stop in each copy/window, and you'd have to manually sync the tracks later. Overall, it seems "Mckey Mouse" and trouble prone... It would be very easy to screw-up a take.

Those Shures are way out of my price range anyway. If I'm missing a mic, I'd probably not spend more than about $30-40 for each extra I have to buy. I have some Radio Shack mics that worked fine last time I used them. Do they have the high quality that a $25,000 condenser mic has? No, but for the price they're plenty good for what I'll be using them for.



I will be recording live performances, not "in a studio". Here's an admittedly poor pic to give you a very basic idea of where it'll be recorded. The pic only shows a very small portion of where it'll be recorded, although we only take up about 1/4 to 1/3 of the space, including the audience AND "stage". Ignore the captions photoshopped into the pic, for the most part.

I doubt we'll have a grand piano there this time. It could be an electronic piano (possibly a Yamaha P80, Yamaha Clavinova CLP-150 (although I doubt its owner will be there), or Casio PX-320 (although its owner, who normally does the sound setup, may not be there either)), or could be an acoustic upright (most likely a 1950s or 1970s Baldwin Hamilton). Size of the group there in the audience is normally around 500-600 or so, but it could be much smaller this year.

Here's a couple shots of the exterior of the building (lifted from google maps, re-hosted on my picasa album to remove link to location) to give you an idea of the size of the building. It's all one big room, except a couple restrooms at one end and a kitchen at the other.


(I thought I had taken a wide angle pic inside the building a couple years ago when it was relatively empty, but I can't find it. (If I had a free program with which I could search for photos on my hard drive taken on certain dates (by EXIF data) I could probably find it fairly quickly.))

You absolutely must have some sort of way to synchronize the clocks of the various cards. Different sound card clocks can drift by a significant fraction of a second over the course of an hour.

As soon as you talk clock sync, you're in pro territory.

Since you are you recording a live event, keep it simple! The more complicated your setup, the more things can go wrong, and there is no chance for a 2nd take. Just record in stereo with microphones, or from the house mixer if there is one. If it's critical that you "capture" the performance, set-up a backup system. Computers are notoriously unreliable. Set-up another computer, a cassette recorder, a hi-fi VCR, or something as a backup, and record to both!

I think you are opening a whole can o' worms with multiple sound cards etc. There is also a lot of things about recording that will affect the final sound, for example, where you put the microphones will have a dramatic effect on the sound. If you have not done any recording before then you should keep it as simple as possible.


My suggestion is to use the Zoom H2 and that's all. Stick on a stand up in the air above the level of the choir (so all the singers can see it directly) and get it back about the distance of the width of the choir. If you are able to record rehearsals then that will give you a chance to try it out. You made need to move the H2 back or forwards to get the balance between the reverberation and the direct sound from the choir. If you go too close however the singers at the back will be too quite compared to the singers in the front. You will have to balance this with the practicalities of where the conductor is standing and the audience are sitting etc. The only draw back to this scenario is that you will have to start the recording well before the performance starts so that you are not pressing buttons and hoisting the H2 up in the air during the show.

Also I have just read that you can do 4-channel recording with the H2, with this in mind, you should try pointing the back of the H2 (This has 120 degree angle between the left and right mics) at the choir. This will allow you to get a wee bit closer. Make sure you record all 4 channels. This will give you 1 set of channels dominated by the choir and the other set dominated by room ambience/reverberation . You can mix them later.

What do you mean by clock drift / sync? Would it mean that if I start recording from 2 cards simultaneously, if they're at the same time, then after "an hour" one might show the recording elapsed time as being 59:59.637 and the other as 1:00:00.428, even though both actually recorded the same amount of time? (meaning if you line up a portion properly at the beginning when doing the mixdown, it could be almost a second out of sync after an hour, as an example?) If so, then that could be a problem. But if as long as when I sync one portion, everything else lines up, I think I could work around that.
Also I'll basically be recording everything start to finish per session, which'll probably be about 6 sessions (anywhere from 2 to 4 hours per session), which means I'll probably be buying a new hard drive (probably a 1TB, maybe a 1.5TB, doubt the 2TBs will come down in price to where they're the same price/GB as a 1 or 1.5TB by then).

I basically want the vocals to be in stereo (for a quartet or smaller I don't need much separation, but for a choral group of say 10-15 or more (possibly 100 or so in some cases) I'll want a nearly full spectrum), and the piano also in stereo (bass notes panned mostly to the left, treble mostly to the right, evenly distributed in between - basically a stereo field comparable to what the pianist experiences). Extra accompaniment instruments can be positioned pretty much wherever on the sound stage, although I'd kind-of like it to be similar to how it looks (either from the audience or performers perspective - can't decide).

As for the backup, I could probably use a Zoom H2 clipped onto the podium. Also there's no house mixer that I'm aware of.
If other people come with equipment to record, I plan to work with them on doing it. Also I probably won't know if I'll be doing it until maybe a week or two before the event, or possibly even the day it starts - it'll be 4 days over Memorial Day weekend.

A problem with using the H2 (especially in 4-channel mode) as my main source is the 2GB per file limit. It takes 30 seconds or so to process and be ready for the next file, which although it starts automatically, means I'll miss a fair portion of audio. When I've used it as a backup, I've set it in 256 or 320 kbps mp3 mode using the 120° mics, and it has worked fine.