Hi there!

I'm new to the forum. I find it very interesting. I've read some topics through google and I see a lot of information here.

Now my question. I want to add a cd player to a vintage system. The reciever is a Pioneer SX-626 with some Marantz Imperial 5-G speakers. Both are from the early 70s and sound good enough for me. I have two players in mind and both cost exactly the same:

- Onkyo DX-7355 (Wolfson WM8716 DAC)
- Denon DVD-1740 (Burr Brown PCM1782 DAC)

The Denon, as you may know, is a DVD player. My system is installed next to a TV, so I could use the DVD capability and upgrade my crappy DVD player. But I don't know if the CDs would sound good. I've read somewhere that DVD players aren't so good at playing CDs. As my system is completely analog, I rely on the digital-to-analog conversion of the player.

What do you think?

Thanks

I'm going to give you the standard answer you'll get on this forum, which is an answer I support very strongly.

All claims of audible differences between CD/DVD players are made by people taking part in uncontrolled slighted comparisons. If you were to perform a blind volume matched test comparing these types of devices you'll probably find CD/DVD players to be indistinguishable in terms of sonics. Purchase the one that is most convenient for you.

Personally if I was in the market for something in your price range I would purchase the OPPO DV-980H. It plays a lot of formats including SACD, Divx, and Xvid. You can also connect an external device to it and play media off that device.

As for the question of if the OPPO sounds better or worse than the eqiupment you've listed, I predict all three would be indistinguishable in a volume controlled blind test.

Thank you for the answer odigg. I understand your point.
About the Oppo player. That would be a good option, sadly I've never seen that brand where I live (I'm from Chile).

And what do you think about the cheap dvd players? There are a lot of brand players (Philips, Samsung, LG, Sony) for less than half the price of the Denon or the Oppo. The thing that concerns me is that the price difference must come from somewhere and the technical specs of those cheap players seem always incomplete, thus hard to trust.

The problem is that as consumers we cannot always tell where that price difference comes from. Past a certain point it's mostly marketing and engineers claiming solutions to problems that nobody honestly demonstrated were actual problems in the first place.

To address you question about cheaper brand name devices. First, I don't think I'd ever buy a CD player ever again. DVD players are easy to find, inexpensive, and can play CDs. So just buy a DVD player.

Second, knowing the exact DAC chip being used is mostly useless marketing information. Everything around the DAC is very important and no consumer knows about all this circuitry. Beyond this, the difference between a "low-end" DAC chip and "high-end" DAC chip is unknown to consumers. I once asked an A/V equipment engineer why they put one type of DAC chip in their less expensive devices and a branded (Burr Brown?) DAC chip in their most expensive models. His answer? "$3." And marketing of course.

Finally, I agree with you that you should avoid the really cheap DVD players. In my experience the no name brand stuff (e.g. Cyber-Power!) tends to be cheaply built, have trouble playing a wide variety of discs, and fail quickly. Based on other experiences I also avoid the really cheap DVD players from even name brands. I had a Samsung Player that had trouble playing even rented DVDs.

I've got one of these from Sony - Sony DVP-NS77H. It works well, has lasted over a year, and plays DVD-RWs, DVDs, DVD+Rs, and CD-RWs without issue. The 1080I/P upconvert also works very well. I picked it up at a local sale for around $75. So you can spend a lot less than that Denon player and still get a decent product.

So if you are spending $ <$50 (USA MSRP) on a DVD player I would probably hesitate. But for $75 - $100, that would be fine. Just make sure it has all the features (e.g. upconvert, HDMI, optical out) that you want. As much as Sony's philosophies bother me, I've had good experiences with Sony products.

Also keep in mind that inexpensive Blu-ray is just around the corner. Sony already sells a $200 Blu ray player.

Hope this helps.

I completely agree with odigg. I have in the past purchased, and eventually thrown out, several <$50 DVD players. The biggest problem was their inability to play my DVD+R or DVD-R discs. I have also had some outright hardware failures. I have never had a problem with a >$50 player.

I think the moer expensive ones generally have better deinterlacing and upscaling than the cheaper ones. Particularly the Oppos.

I don't have any facts, but I've read the opposite... The "current rumor" is that the new super-cheap Chinese DVD players will "play anything". I suspect this is somewhat true, but it probably comes from the fact that almost any new player can play DVD-R, DVD+R, DVD-R/W, etc, whereas maybe your old player that cost $250 five years ago cannot. (I think you need a high-end DVD player to play DVD-Audio and SACD, as these require additional licensing.)

Personally I usually go for the lower-end when it comes to something like a CD/DVD player.* Whatever you buy, it's going to break eventually and it won't be worth repairing, at not least here in the U.S. where repair labor is expensive. (Your receiver & speakers may last "forever". Electronic parts usually last longer than moving/mechanical parts. Speakers can last a long time too, as long as the woofers don't have foam surrounds which tend to deteriorate.)

And, I don't "feel bad" when something cheap breaks! My VCR just died. I probably bought it 4 or 5 years ago for about $30 USD. The only bad thing is nobody sells VCRs anymore... You can only find DVD/VCR combo units and I had to pay more than $30 to replace it. My DVD player had died a couple of weeks before. It was newer than the VCR and it was not a bottom-of-the-line unit, but it died first! (Too bad I replaced it before the VCR died... Now, I have a DVD recorder/player in my living room and a combo unit coming.)

* If I'm buying something like speakers or headphones, I'm much more picky and I will pay more for good sound! Oh... That $30 VCH did have Hi-Fi audio, which was the only special feature I cared about!

My recommendation is for a cheap no-name DVD player, unless you want the look and feel of a branded unit to match your existing stereo or you want a CD player for other reasons like evoking a certain period (e.g. the 90s).

If you do want the look/feel/period-ness then you might consider a 2nd hand CD player (that might not play CD-R). The two options are probably pretty similar in cost.

Thank you all for the guidance!
I think I will use my cheap DVD for now and I will save some money for a blu ray player. Like odigg said, the price difference between a Hi-Fi CD player and a Blu Ray player is just too small. There is a Philips for around US$220 right now. And maybe if I wait some time, I can find one even cheaper.

Hey oravla, is bluray media and HDTV readily accessible down there in Chile? I'm asking cause maybe I'll move there in the future

A Panasonic Blu-ray player is already available for $150 USD, although I know outside the USA it's probably being sold for full price. I think that turning point is here and I suspect in the next 6-12 months we'll just have a deluge of affordable Blu-ray players.

Blu-ray seems to be taking over faster than DVD killed the VCR. I imagine that since Blu-ray players can play DVDs people will have little reason to buy DVD players. Now I just need an good opportunity to sandpaper my DVD player lens

Right now HDTV is only available through paid services (Cable and Satellite) and even so the offer is small (around 6 channels). But HDTV is growing fast, specially now that the government has chosen the over the air DTV broadcast standard (they choose the Japanese standard).
Bluray discs are easy to find if you live in one of the major cities. Where do you plan to live?

I'm not being too serious about moving particularly there, but I don't rule it out either. I'm spoiled by how easy it is access to technology here in the US, my comment was jut half-serious. I would like to visit though, I went there in 89, Santiago and some small towns that I'm sorry I don't remember their names (Peulla was one of them) then to Argentina, and the Brazilian part of Iguazu.