For everybody fighting with occasional clipping (or perfectionists wanting to test everything) you should try the attached sample, udial.

Testing:

• play the sample in your favourite player (decoded or not, having disabled all DSPs and EQs that can interfere)
  
• if the output sounds weird at any time you should:
  • lower the output vol. in your soundcard config (should be the speaker icon in your system tray).
  • For some soundcards 48kHz is better (audigy 2 etc.).
  • lower the vol. till the sample doesn't sound weird at any time.

The output will sound really weird if your settings clip.
Your output can occasional clip without you knowing/hearing it. But for us perfectionists this will theoretically give a better quality output.

ATTENTION: Play this sample at a low volume anytime, even if you hear nothing special! It can be very harmful to equipment and/or your ears.
It's strongly recommended to use some very cheap (PC) speakers if you want to test this,
otherwise you might really ruin your tweeters (it has happened several times already).

I'll try it and then I tell about it!!!

It's a kind of joke??? With foobar is imposible to set for listen without the weird ugly distortion, even lowing the level of the soundcard to minimum. I only can listen normaly with Resampler (SSRS) plugin on (Resampler settings: Target sample rate: 48000, Internal Precision 64bit). With this settings I can set my soundcard to maximum levels (wave and play control) with any distortion. . Note: for this test I disabled all DSP and Replay Gain except the Resampler (SSRS) plugin.
Jan S. tell me if I made well the test, thanks in advance.

I listened to it OK with all my DSP plugins off, it sounded like it clips in the middle but there's no distortion. It sounds like someone dialing I tried all volume levels and it sounded the same with same clip in the middle. But then I turned on my DSPs and it sounded very different. I don't know what you meant by weird but it wasn't like phone dialing anymore. Then my QCD player crashed I use a stereo-link external USB audio device.

what you can conclude from your test is that you should always use 48kHz.
With my soundcard I need to use 48kHz too.

btw.: did you need 64bit? isn't 32bits enough?

Tecnically it's clipping you should hear if something is wrong; but to me it doesn't sound like normal clipping but very distorted (not clean dialing sounds anymore).
If it does anything fishy and doesn't just sound like dealing something is not right.

edit: dealing --> dialing

I don't know why but only I can hear well with the Resampler plugin on and set to 48000 or up. I guess that my soundcard resample to 48000, it's an old SB 512 PCI. About the 64 bits setting, when I installed foobar in my system I was set to 64 bits and I just forget it , but I can hear any difference between the two sets (32 and 64 bits internal precision) and I don't really knows what is the differences between both. Can you tell me about it? I try it resampling to 44100 or less and the sounds in horribly, only works with 48000 or more.
Another curiosity, when I listen throught my receiver with Dolby Surround Pro- Logic on, I can listen the dial sound in front and center channel, and another sounds (like a laser gun) coming from the rear channels but a few milisecs later. It's weird

I am not sure about the distortion. I do get the weird sounds regardless of volume level. But it sure drives my dogs nuts. They really freak.

19.5 kHz !
At full power in headphones, I heard a 19.5 kHz sine

...and my hearing doesn't go past 16 kHz

Edit : be careful, don't fry your tweeters with this ultrasonic sample.

Well... it looks as if it isn't clipping for me. Btw, if you want to know what it sounds like when it clips, I managed to get what I think is the correct effect by adding the soft clipping limiter dsp in foobar. The touch-tones get completely screwed up.

Yeah, I just clipped my ears with the 19.5khz tone.

same here, except that i didn't need to hear it in full volume, and i can hear it pumping as well

if you're using headphones, do not turn up the volume

I suppose my sound card is really screwed up. I can only hear the sample normallyy if I resample at 32000 Hz or below. 44.1 Hz and above and I get the "laser beam" sound at any volume.
I have a C-Media sound chip on my motherboard which is relatively recent.
Any ideas?

MonkeysAudio is so annoying. No separate WinAMP plugin? Baah, I'm not installing a 3 meg package to play back this sample.

If you give me an email address I cand send you "MAC Winamp Plugin (PIMP).zip" (92,0 KB)

When I have foobars resampler on and set to 48kHz or more, the sound I hear is WEIRD. It sounds like aliens trying to communicate with me And on each samplerate the sound's different. With 44kHz and 96kHz I only hear a high frequency tone there, beginning a short time before one second mark (same position where the alien sounds come on other samplerates). Under 44kHz, the file sounds normal. My soundcard is an old SoundBlaster PCI128 and I'm using Kernel Streaming in foobar. I tried with DirectSound and I got nearly same results, only the alien sound was a little bit different, and I got a "humming" voice on the background when playing the sample.

Maybe they are getting desperate to reach you (the aliens I mean); LOL
Can't wait to get to work to try it out, at work I have some ultra cheep integrated sound chip, willl see how it fares.

EDIT: spelling

Ugh! I hear too annoying ultra-high pitched tones. That's strange, since the high pitched tones are at the region between 19.3 KHz and 20.4 KHz, and I can hear just up to 18 KHz or 18.5 KHz at insane levels. Now I'm playing with a mid-quality motherboard card. I think the tones may be getting audible due to some intermodulation distortion going on at playback, because I can hear those high freq tones just when the lower freq phone tones are sounding, but not when alone (Not true, see edit). I'll try at home, using a higher quality card, and also measuring the output of the card, and try to see what's going on.

FB2K resampler causes obvious audible distortion if you put the attenuator before the resampler, but not the inverse. I wonder why?

Edit: the low frequency phone tones have nothing to do, since filtering them the high freq tones remain audible.
Edit: the problem must be at the card I'm using now, because with it I can hear 19 KHz pure tones, and at home with my better card I couldn't, at least last times I tried.

Ugh, you should put a warning when you post samples that sound horrible, listening to that loud makes me want to barf

Heh, my vile AC'97 chip plays it fine all the way up to winamp 100% & sound properties 100%. No silly resampling options or 256 bit precision

I'd love to know what it sounds like when it's "wrong"... cuz that sounds more than a little unpleasant to me

That is the craziest sample ever. How does it work?

When I first played it on my Audigy, I got the weird alien sounds. I discovered that removing the soft-clipping limiter filter in foobar removes the alien sounds. Not only that, the weird alien sounds sound different depending on if the filter is before or after the resampler filter. Also with the resampler off I get the alien sounds and crackling sounds, but they all go away when SSRC 48kHz resampling's on - attributing to the Audigy's crappy built-in resampler...

What a useful sample!

My results for Audigy 2 Platinum eX using WinAmp 2.91:

Asio 0.26i - no sound (can't get it to work at all)
DirectSound 2.2.26 - Horrible clipping distortion regardless of Creative Control Panel Master or Wave volume controls
Exp. DirectSound 1.37 - as above
Simple KS Output - as above
WaveOut 2.0.2a - as above
WaveOut 2.0.1 SSRC 48/16 - hi-freq distortion replaced by low-freq hum (kicks in after 0.7 secs or so)!
WaveOut 2.0.1 SSRC 48/24 - as above
WaveOut 2.0.1 SSRC 96/24 - as above

The results above stay mostly the same, if I switch to Foobar 2K. ASIO/KernelStream will not play 44.1kHz without resampling. Asio/KernelStream/WaveOut are either horribly distorted (at 44.1kHz or don't play) or get the low frequency hum artifact (when resampled to 48kHz or beyond). This is regardless of which output is selected.

Only DirectSound at 96 kHz resampling (32 or 64 bits) is ALMOST without the distortion AND completely without the low frequency hum. There is still tiny amount of high frequency distortion at these settings.

I can get rid of this last trace (I think) of distortion by reducing the Master volume control to c. 50% and the same for Wave/mp3 playback volume (both in Creative Surround mixer). These are not exact figures, as I didn't have time to test all percentile value combinations one by one. I still have to connect the Audigy 2 to my main testing rig to verify whether the distortion was just masked or truly eliminated. At least it's not horribly audible anymore.

My results for RME DIGI 96/8 PAD with FooBar 2K 0.62 using ASIO (no resampling or dsps active):

No clipping/distortion/hum regardless of volume, Attenuation or other controls in RME Digi Settings Control panel

I can conclude that the best of Creative right now (Audigy 2 Platinum eX) is still not good enough for critical listening if it produces artifacts like this. The difference between RME and Audigy 2 Platinum eX at default (or 'normal') settings is unbelievable.

One really has to hear it with their own ears to believe it.

regards,
Halcyon

PS My guess is that the aliasing intermodulation distortion in Creative's card is to blame for this artifact. Finally I have an example sample that I can give people to when they complain that RMAA IMD measurements are unfair (and 'theoretical') towards Creative products.

The sample itself is also largely theorethical. If present in real music, many people would be left with smoking tweeters.

Great work! I knew before that my onboard VIA AC'97 sound needs 48KHz input, but now I know how Windows Volume sliders need to be set ... really nice.

Here some samples to compare (lowpassed versions of the test sample)

Correct - This is how it should sound.

The next samples are the the original sample amplified by +x.x dB to cause audible clipping and lowpassed afterwards.
Clipping +0.1 dB
Clipping +0.2 dB
Clipping +0.5 dB
Clipping +1.5 dB

the squirling reminds me of a bird singing.... guess thats not normal

On this computer I get a birdy sound, depending on the mixer configuration.
If I higher the overall volume but reduce the wav volume, it is ok

Does somebody have .flac version of this sample or can somebody recommend a small ape winamp plugin?

thanks, fragtal

udial.flac

thanks! that was quick

Garf,

Why is this sample theoretical? Can you elaborate? I'm not claiming it's not, but I'm interested in your opinion. Further, why would it result in blown tweeters? Do you think that aliasing intermodulation causing D/A-converters are so commonplace or is ther another reason? I'm willing to learn more.

Also, does anybody know the source of this sample?

Just out of curiosity I burned the sample to an audio cd and tried playback on my portable Panasonic SL-CT780 and my DVD player Philips SA-962. Panasonic has audible noise (static) in burst over the sample. Philips SA-962 plays back the sample faultlessly (at least to my ear).

This reminds me of another interesting sample I have on Digital Recordings' "CD-Check" cd. It also produces audible static type noise on most sound cards and on my Panasonic portable CD-player.

I can upload that, if anybody's interested.

I also tried the DirectSound Resampling plugin v.2.2.6 for Winamp 2.x and the results remain the same: horrible distortion regardless of volume settings.

Regards,
Halcyon

PS Monkey's Audio Winamp 2.xx plug-in without the full Ape 3.97 download (only 116 kB):

http://www.geocities.com/feedthedead/in_ape.zip

It contains a loud (somewhere between 0 and -1 dB I'd say) ~20000 Hz modulated sine tone. The audible dialing sounds are much lower volume, otherwise the combination of both would cause cipping in the file (not only during playback). So even if for some reason "real" music would contain similar high frequency tones, they'll hardly be louder than the audible signal (Why should anyone want to do this?* It'd just waste dynamic range).


If you set playback volume (of the relatively low volume audible tones) to a "normal" level the (almost) inaudible loud tone will be played back at a verry uncommon level, so tweeters might overheat ...


I guess CoolEdit (Pro) was used to create it. It can create DTMF signals and modulated sines (and mix both).
______________________
* I think, high pitched loud tones or noise could be used as kind of CD copy protection. Let's discuss this in another thread. ATM I'm creating some samples and will start the thread when I'm finished ...
[edit]
Done. High pitched noise = copy protection, against PC playback, mp3, lossless ...
[/edit]

Ok I did a test at work, with SoundMax integrated chipset on an intel board (don't know the exact version of the chipset) and KSC-35 headphones:

Results (using foobar), on all the tests setting the system volume to lower value didn't help in the sense that it only lowers the volume but the distortion is still there:
No SSRC: Dialing sound with horrific ultrasonic distortions (really loud)
SSRC @44100: same as above
SSRC @48000: Dialing sound with barely audible ultrasonic distortion (it now hides at higher ranges ~16khz+), however being barely audible didn't help since it still gave me headaches.

SSRC's slow/fast, 64/32bit modes didn't help in any variation. Using Soft clipping limiter made things way worse.
Same results apply to all three output methods (kernel, DirectSound and WaveOut).

So you won't catch me listening to this sample on the setup ever again!

(shitty soundcards)

EDIT: Actually this soundcard is so bad that Ella Fitzgerald sounds shrill on it (Ella is anything but shrill)

Wow, that gave me a headache

I can hear clicking, and humming. I did not apply any resampling !

Then maybe you should!

I have to pull down the master-volume (of the Crative Mixer)to one third and then this strange sound appears decent without distorsion or so. I'm using Winamp2.81 with DirectSoundOutput2.26 SSRC without resampling. The Audigy 2 Platinum upsamples to 96kHz.

I have not kept the master volume at this low level. When I try to listen to a not replaygained dvd-ogm-rip with Sennheiser HD600 Headphones I have to set the volume of the Headphone amp of my soundcard to maximum and even then it's sometimes hard to understand.

I hear up to 15kHz but sadly i couldn't make this fabulous experience of hearing 19kHz sine tones...

OK, I tried it with resampling and here are the results

8000 - even crapper quality, no humming or aliens
11025 - crapper quality, no humming or aliens
16000 - crap quality, no humming or aliens
22050 - a bit more higher pitch
24000 - perfect, but slightly higher pitch
32000 - sounds perfect
44100 - no clipping, humming and louder aliens
48000 - no clipping, but is humming and alien sound!
64000 - whistling sound?
88200 - humming, aliet, ambulance??
96000 - humming with slight alien sound

Does this mean I have a crap sound card?

Would anyone be willing to take the sweep.wav sample, resample it to 48000hz, and then normalize that 48000hz file to 100% ? I bet you will get the alien sounds as well. This was the test that I used a few months ago to see how high I could set the volume sliders on my SB-Live card. When I get home, I will see how my settings hold up against this sample.......

Ehh... What are you supposed to hear? It sounds like telephone ringing using Winamp 2.81 and a Hercules Fortissimo III 7.1 sound card at 44.1kHz...

Jan S. you should advice that take the test with this sample with very care. Yesterday when I test mu sound card in my home theather system (jbl speakers around $1000), 2 tweeters of the satelites were fried , and I crying now . I can't buy a brand new, here in my country $1000 is exactly that I get for 6 month in my job, very expensive for me. And it seems to I can't repaired it too. . Now I can listen music until about 8 khz only, sounds like shitty. My system never will sounds transparent like before . So guys, I don't wish that this happen with any of us. Take care!!!

sorry to read that

@grbmusic bummer man, sorry for your speakers...

I tried the same sample with my SBlive 5.1; The best setting (not surprisingly) was with SSRC at 48000Hz but even at this setting I could still hear some weird ambulance in the background (not like the super annoying ultrasonic I've experienced with SoundMAX) but weird all the same; With both cards I can't make it to sound like tigre's mpc.

Two chains in my system, both fed by a TerraTec EWX 24/96 ...

1. Digital chain ... EWX 24/96 (Wav Play Digital) - 10m Toslink cable - Sony MD Recorder MDS-JE700 as DAC - Sennheiser HD600

2. Analog chain ... EWX 24/96 (Wav Play Analog) - Normal Cinch cable - Denon PMA-700V Stereo Amp (10 years old) - Sennheiser HD 600

Used both SoundForge 6.0 and WinAmp 2.91 (out_ds.dll 2.2.6) for PB at 44,1 kHz ... no audible artifacts whatsoever ...

Seems that my Soundcard's DAC is pretty good with my current settings ...

Pure telephone dialing sounds without anything else ...

Earlier in this thread I provided samples about what it's supposed to sound and what it's not

i'm very sorry about your speakers

surely the intent of this test was not to damage people's equipment

did you read the warnings posted by garf and pio?

@tigre
About the sample you provided, I can hear quite a lot of background noise about 1.5 seconds after the start, why is that?

Which one?

The mpc sample you provided named correct.mpc.

My HD-600 were plugged into a 80W amplifier.

Here are my results :

Windows XP, Winamp 2.90 (the Windows version might have an importance)

Marian Marc 2 soundcard :

WaveOut - Digital out : perfect
WaveOut - Analog out : perfect
DirectSound - Digital out emulated : No artifacts, but an incredible background noise, like with any other music (the Direct Sound support for this card seems broken with WinXP)
DirectSound - Analog out emulated : Same background noise, but with a police car yelling UIUIUIUIUI !

SoundBlaster SB 64 PCI V :
WaveOut : high pitched artifact, and clipping
Directsound : high pitched artifact, but no clipping

correct.flac

form 0.7 - 2.6 sec. there's some background noise that isn't there during the rest of the sample but that's also the case in the original sample. If it's less than in the .mpc file it could be a problem with your mpc decoder/playback. Here both (.mpc and .flac) sound the same.

That's weird because I'm using foobar2000 for palyback and it doesn't have problems with mpc playbak AFAIK. BTW I decompressed the flac it it sound ok (without noise) as opposed to the mpc. What soundcard do you use?

EDIT: I just tried the mpc again, the problem was that it had replaygain that somehow changed the sound once I removed it the two samples sounded the same (with background noise (low))

The same here with my SB 512 PCI and with my onboard (SIS 710) sounds worst.
Still I'm crying for my speakers . Thanks of God I can get brand new tweeters (JBL Titanium) in my country but it's expensive yet, with a bit of luck I will can buy them the next month, only 2 of 5 weren fried