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Topic: Possibly the final version of OGGDROP?? (Read 9972 times) previous topic - next topic
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Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Another version of oggdrop will soon be at the usual place: http://www.inf.ufpr.br/~rja00/

This version provides a CBR option, in addition to the normal ABR option, within bitrate selection just to make it easier to use. Also, all bitrate selectors now increment in 1k units from 32k to 512k with '0' as the default.

I think this is bug free. I tried all the options I could think of without any problems. However, if you find a problem, do please advise.

Enjoy!

john33

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #1 –
The files are ALREADY at the usual place. 

Regards;

Roberto.

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #2 –
Quote
This version provides a CBR option, in addition to the normal ABR option...
ABR??? Doesn't ogg use VBR???

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #3 –
Wow, I just checked out your version John. NEATO! I never knew you could do ABR and CBR with ogg like that. I love the enhanced tick and display features too. Great work!

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #4 –
AFAIK Ogg provides all three modes of operation: vbr, abr, cbr. In the previous versions of Oggdrop you could only use abr. Now you can use whatever you want!

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #5 –
Yes, Ogg Vorbis new provides VBR, ABR and CBR modes
Using the quality settings is VBR
Specifying a bitrate is ABR
Specifying bitrate = min bitrate = max bitrate is CBR

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #6 –
Quote
Yes, Ogg Vorbis new provides VBR, ABR and CBR modes
Using the quality settings is VBR
Specifying a bitrate is ABR
Specifying bitrate = min bitrate = max bitrate is CBR
Tangent - I believe you got those last two backwards:
Specifying a bitrate is CBR
Specifying bitrate = min bitrate = max bitrate is ABR

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #7 –
Quote
Tangent - I believe you got those last two backwards:
Specifying a bitrate is CBR
Specifying bitrate = min bitrate = max bitrate is ABR

No, he got them the right way around.
Just specifying a bitrate is ABR. specifying bitrate = min bitrate = max bitrate is *also* ABR, but cripples the encoder by not letting it use more bits in the short periods that ABR would allow. And both of them sound worse than just specifying a quality level.

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #8 –
Quote
Originally posted by Gecko
AFAIK Ogg provides all three modes of operation: vbr, abr, cbr. In the previous versions of Oggdrop you could only use abr. Now you can use whatever you want!


Actually, the previous encoder allowed only VBR, not ABR.

The 'bitrate' options in that encoder were really aliases for what are '-q' modes now.

--
GCP

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #9 –
To put it another way - bitrate management was only introduced in RC3. (I think I got that riight!)

john33

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #10 –
Thanks for making things clear! Anyways: oggdrop just got better

Some suggestions for the interface:

In the quality setting: please make the text box editable. I like the way you can make fine adjustments, but with that short scrollbar it's not easy to select the desired quality level.

I also don't think it is a good idea to distribute the whole bitrate settings over two seperate windows. Especially the "jumping" radio button is quite annoying since you can't simply switch back to vbr; you have to exit that window, right-click, select "encode parameters" which immediately lets the radio button jump to vbr again. This will confuse people if by just opening a window their settings change.

Furthermore I don't think that splitting the encode parameters is newbie friendly. They will click around until they find the advanced settings and say: "Ahhhh! So that is where I set my bitrate!" You could perhaps place all the options in one window but grey out the abr/cbr settings. They could be activated by a check box "enable cbr/abr modes (NOT recomended!)" or something in the lines of that. Maybe on activation even pop-up an extra warning window (ok, most users will just click that away). Also: don't call them advanced since that leads people to believe that abr/cbr is better.

Another thing: I haven't experimented with oggdrop too much, but if double-click on main window is not in use then why not make it open the encoding parameters?

Oggdrop has become much better, but I still think it can be improved.

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #11 –
I completely second Gecko.

Now, what I'd really love to see is the ability to create tags from filename (selectable option).

Goes like:
%artist - %title (%album, %customtag)
And OGGDROP encodes the files of the 'xxx - yyy (zzz, qqq)' format according to specs. (%customtag can be any tag you'd like to add to your file like %rg_audiophile or something)

Only problem I see is 'smart detection' with tracks like 'Motörhead -  Bomber (Live) (Bootleg, 1989).ogg'
+ maybe implementation of %wc / %wildcard / ? (or some symbol unrecognised in filenames) to remove unwanted info:
093Motörhead - Bomber -> ???%artist - %title


Hope it doesn't sound too complicated - guess not 
Would be state-of-art though

ephemeros

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #12 –
I like the suggestions in the previous two posts.  However, shouldn't some of the more technical stuff be left to oggenc with frontend?  Oggdrop should stay simple and accessible to newbies...
God kills a kitten every time you encode with CBR 320

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #13 –
I'll think about these suggestions and let you know.

With regard to the quality setting and using the slider. Once you have given 'focus' to the slider, you can use the right and left arrows on the keyboard which increment/decrement 0.1 at a time - much easier to set the quality you want that way.

john33

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #14 –
OK, taking the various suggestions offered, here is what I think will be the final version, cosmetically, of oggdrop(carries yesterday's date), available soon at: http://www.inf.ufpr.br/~rja00/

I have placed all the encoding options in one dialogue box.

On the Quality side, the slider has been increased in length and is, therefore, easier to adjust with the mouse. However, once the slider has the focus, left and right arrows keys can be used to set the quality level. Added narrative to make things clearer (hopefully) for 'newbies'.

On the Bitrate side, the separate CBR bitrate box is gone. selecting CBR now links and equalises Min and Max values to the value of Nom. Selecting ABR breaks that link and allows independent selection of Min and Max values.

I think that this is a cleaner interface for all levels of user. Hopefully, its clearer for 'newbies', and not irritating for the more expert user.

I am still pondering the other suggestions, but don't expect anything else too quickly, if at all. Some of the ideas would require major surgery in other areas apart from the interface, and I am not sure I wish to, or should get too far into that.

Anyway, 'you can't please all of the people all of the time', so ENJOY!

john33

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #15 –
Done!

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #16 –
Strange - whether I choose ABR or CBR, the Quality button stays selected, and the nominal bitrate on the main screen never changes...
It's is not, it isn't ain't, and it's it's, not its, if you mean it is.  If you don't, it's its.

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #17 –
same bug here

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #18 –
I'll check it out.

john33

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #19 –
How extremely nice! Thank you!

Bugs verified. (radio button on vbr mode allways on; nominal bitrate shows that of vbr mode even if non vbr mode is selected - in fact I can't permanently select abr/crb mode. A quick test shows quality mode is used (to encode) no matter what I select!)

Bitrate selection in abr mode should be "smarter", i.e.: "min bitrate" <= "nominal bitrate" <= "max bitrate". In cbr mode I would grey out or simply hide the min/max boxes.

Does "double-click on main window" currently have a function?

Greets... Gecko

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #20 –
Sorry about that guys!  If I had a pound or a dollar, or should it be a euro? for every time that I have screwed up working code by 'cleaning it up', I should be very rich by now!

Anyway new versions just uploaded to Roberto under today's date.

(I still can't think exactly what it was that I did, but nevermind, it's OK now.)

john33

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #21 –
Files already online!

Regards;

Roberto.

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #22 –
OK, Roberto's girlfriend is going to kill me!!  Gecko, your suggestions regarding disabling bitrate boxes and preventing bizarre bitrate selections were too good to ignore, so they're done!

Basically, select Quality and all bitrate boxes are disabled (greyed); select ABR and all bitrate boxes are enabled with min not permitted to be higher than nom and max not permitted to be lower than nom. This was actually catered for in the core code, but I think it makes sense to take care of it here. Select CBR and min and max are disabled, but still register the nom bitrate changes.

So, hopefully everyone will be happy, except Roberto's girlfriend!

Files have been uploaded to Roberto so should be available soon.

john33

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #23 –
Anybody thinks that Robert has been continously reporting "New files are now online!" just to get into the top 5 posts list?

Possibly the final version of OGGDROP??

Reply #24 –
Sorry, I won't report anything anymore.

-@$$hole(s)-

Bye.