Skip to main content ↑ ↓

Notice

Please note that most of the software linked on this forum is likely to be safe to use. If you are unsure, feel free to ask in the relevant topics, or send a private message to an administrator or moderator. To help curb the problems of false positives, or in the event that you do find actual malware, you can contribute through the article linked here.
Topic: QuickTime FLAC component? (Read 114314 times) previous topic - next topic
0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

QuickTime FLAC component?

QuickTime still doesn't support FLAC or any other compressed, lossless audio that I've seen.  Has there been anybody that has tried making a QT component for FLAC?  Some people made an OGG component over at http://qtcomponents.sourceforge.net/, but the project looks like it died a while ago.

Is there a reason why nobody has made a FLAC component for QuickTime?  I want to hop on the lossless codec bandwagon, but I still much prefer iTunes for managing my library  (say what you will).  I've been looking at QuickTime sample code for the last few days, trying to understand their crazy Component api, but I haven't done anything in C/C++ for the last few years, so it's going kind of slowly.  There's not anybody lurking in HA that is secretly developing a FLAC QT component, is there?   

That's all for now.

ps. I'm sure most everybody here knows, but iTunes uses QuickTime to decode all of its music (apart using an internal routine for decoding MP3s).  So, QT FLAC codec = FLAC in iTunes. 

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #1 –
a couple people have started but no one has finished yet.  the first one gets the glory!

you could try asking on the flac-dev list.

Josh

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #2 –
I only found one thread in the mailing list about a quicktime component over at flac-dev from about 6 - 12 months ago, and that guy was also just wondering about it.  I also posted an email that's about 3 or 4 days old that's not getting any responses.

::sigh::

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #3 –
If someone can get me the shell of a component and would take the responsibilty of compiling and testing, I'd be willing to fill in the codec guts.  Maybe Apple has a [license-compatible] AIFF component or something to use as the starting point even.

Josh

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #4 –
The sample code I was looking at is http://developer.apple.com/samplecode/Samp.../audiocodec.htm .  They have a version for both mac and windows.  It's basically a ulaw codec, so I think it would be possible to gut and replace that.  90% of that looked foreign to me.  I'm not sure if it was the terminology of all the low level codec terminology of samples and frames and bits or if it was the QuickTime API.  Hopefully you have better luck with it.

I'm sure you must be busy doing dev work on FLAC and in real life, but I'm sure hundreds and eventually thousands of people would love you for a QuickTime FLAC component, supplying them with the first integrated native codec for a compressed, lossless format.


Flight16

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #5 –
What I really need is someone who will sign up to do the compilation and testing of the code.

Josh

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #6 –
Quote
What I really need is someone who will sign up to do the compilation and testing of the code.

Josh,

I can help. I was the one sending iTunes AAC files back and forth to menno. I can definitely do the testing for you. And I can probably take care of the compilation of the code as well. I'm dying for lossless support in iTunes. The ability to add/edit iTunes tags and album artwork is also a must. As far as I'm concerned, who ever gets their first wins.

"Build it and people will come, Ray."

You made a couple/few comments about tags and artwork in the WMA 9 Lossless thread I started when atici mentioned embedded CUE sheets in FLAC. No, I don't think you should be adding artwork to CUE sheets. Everyone seems to have hi-jacked Golden Hawk's CUE sheets, but it's their standard, and only TITLE, PERFORMER, SONGWRITER, CATALOG, ISRC, and REM entries are supported. And, no, I don't think you really need to worry about supporting any of those either.

Forget the CUE sheets, their real purpose is to re-create CDs, but who in Hell really cares about CDs anymore? I'd much rather see everyone support a common set of media library tags. And the two formats out front are clearly Apple's iTunes and M$'s WMA. Apple's got 40% of the portable player market with the iPod, and the lion's share of legal downloads with the iTunes Music Store, so why not support iTunes compatible tags and artwork in FLAC (on both PCs and Macs)?

"People will come, Ray. People will most definitely come."

Regards,

Jay

P.S. Regarding the compilation of the code: you'll need help with this to put together the OS X plug-in for iTunes/QuickTime, but why not just start with a Windows XP plug-in for iTunes/QuickTime? Yes? No?
Watching for pigs on the wing...

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #7 –
OK, good, will PM you.

Quote
P.S. Regarding the compilation of the code: you'll need help with this to put together the OS X plug-in for iTunes/QuickTime, but why not just start with a Windows XP plug-in for iTunes/QuickTime? Yes? No?

I don't have XP either... I have an old NT4 box, not sure if that is up to the requirements.

Josh

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #8 –
Jay,

You go man! FLAC support in iTunes/Quicktime via a plugin would be great! A much needed free lossless option to Microsoft...

The more Apple stays away from supporting Microsoft products (codecs at least) the better. With the HP announcement of putting a copy of iTunes on every consumer HP PC they sell, iTunes will surely grow in number of Windows users as well.

If this takes off, pehaps even Apple will adopt FLAC native support in both its iPod series fo players and its iTunes software. I see they have a position open for a person very familiar with writing audio encoders/codecs also.

Thanks for all your work on this Jay. And thanks to Josh for the excellent FLAC format!

P.S. And Josh, don't you think its time for an XP/computer upgrade 

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #9 –
Quote
The ability to add/edit iTunes tags and album artwork is also a must. As far as I'm concerned, who ever gets their first wins.

AFAIK there is no way to do this - iTunes doesn't support QuickTime metadata and vice versa.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #10 –
QuickTime and iTunes don't support each other's metadata?  That seems just silly!  But if you aren't doing a lot of work, it wouldn't be too hard to rig up an applescript (and a small util on windows in VB, .net, Java, or whatever it is people are using these days) to transfer tags to and from the FLAC files.  So while it might not be "seamless", it will at least only take one or two clicks.

I'm running Panther with XCode and can compile for 10.1 - 10.3.  I also have XP with Visual Studio 6 (and I might be able to get enterprise from my school's IT program).  So if you need somebody to compile code, I can help with that.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #11 –
Quote
AFAIK there is no way to do this - iTunes doesn't support QuickTime metadata and vice versa.

Interesting. I know I can add/edit tags for AAC files (and I'm assuming MP3s as well) from within iTunes. I know the tags are being added directly to the AAC files (as opposed to being stored elsewhere). I can move the files from the Mac to the PC and vise versa and the tags and artwork are right where they belong. I know iTunes will also allow me to add tags to .WAV files, but it won't allow me to add artwork. I haven't nosed around to see whether the metadata is being added to the .WAVs or whether it's just being stored elsewhere (my guess is elsewhere). I know it sounds nutty, but it's the album covers I'd like to see most. With hard drives getting bigger and cheaper by the minute, I'd go with uncompressed .WAVs if I could just add the darned album covers!

What we need to do is find out who one or more of the iTunes programmers are and ask them about the limitations imposed upon any iTunes/QuickTime plug-ins. Obviously they would know whether it's possible to add tagging support to "outsider" file formats.

"Why can’t we all just get along?"

Regards,

Jay
Watching for pigs on the wing...

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #12 –
Apple has some mailing lists about quicktime that might be useful:

http://www.lists.apple.com/mailman/listinfo/quicktime-talk
http://www.lists.apple.com/mailman/listinfo/quicktime-api

I'm a bit concerned because I remember reading that when people used the OGG QT Component iTunes gave an error saying "Album Artwork not Supported" or something along those lines.  I'm not 100% sure though.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #13 –
I never tested Artwork feature in iTunes when using the iTunes.  However I do remeber that the tags did work with later builds of the Ogg QT Plug-in.

However, the only bug that bothered me was the fact the plug-in had to read the Ogg file into memory until it hit an EOF condition and then it would play. This lead to long delays between Ogg tracks....


ss1.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #14 –
hoooray!

this is great!

we've needed a lossless format for iTunes *forever*

thanks sooo much.

i have two systems that i could test on:

athlon 1700+ w/ 512 ram running windows XP
and
iBook 700 w/ 640 ram running OS X 10.3.1

<-[Ph3N0]-> (visiting from ArsTechnica)

send me an email if you'd like me to test out anything:
j i m i v 0 1 [at] y a h o o [dot] c o m (hand-crafted spam blocker, remove the spaces and change the words in brackets to symbols)

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #15 –
Quote
What we need to do is find out who one or more of the iTunes programmers are and ask them about the limitations imposed upon any iTunes/QuickTime plug-ins. Obviously they would know whether it's possible to add tagging support to "outsider" file formats.

The best option would be to convince them to add support for QuickTime metadata. Ie. if the file has artist, etc. set in QuickTime, iTunes would recognise it. It'd probably be wise to wait until there is a component to add the support to, though

It's worth noting that iTunes doesn't actually tag anything other than MP3 and AAC - it simply stores the metadata in the database.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #16 –
Hey, I was just wondering what the status was on this.  I know it's only been about a 15 days, but was wondering how things looked.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #17 –
the order of things currently is:

1. finish ogg flac support: only thing left is the seek routine and metaflac
2. callback-based metadata editing interface
3. QT component

Josh

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #18 –
I'd just like to add that I would also very much appreciate a FLAC QuickTime codec.

If for some reason this effort doesn't work out, perhaps we could create a prize for a successful implementation? A couple of hundred people throwing in a $1 each by PayPal could be quite effective.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #19 –
How's it looking jcoalson ?

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #20 –
I am also looking forward to FLAC support in iTunes... especially since that would greatly simplify the process of transcoding FLAC to iTunes' *.aac/*.m4a! Rest assured, that whenever this project is finished it will be received with great acclaim and appreciation.

    - M.

Edit: I forgot to mention that I am using Windows XP... and about the only reason I have iTunes installed is for the purpose of encoding AAC audio. Silly, but that's how it is.  (Well, that and the fact that my wife is a Mac fanatic, and when we're on the road her iMac can't travel... but my laptop can. iTunes makes her happy.)

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #21 –
It would definitely be great to use it along with QuickTime Broadcaster

Thanks for your great work jcoalson.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #22 –
I am liking this.  This looks extremely promising.  You will be greatly appreciated.

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #23 –
MacWorld has a frontpage editorial requesting Apple to include support for FLAC. Ironically, it misses the most logical reason to support FLAC--lossless compressed audio is of enormous benefit to its media creation initiatives (i.e. Shake, Garageband, audio tracks for its video editors). Of course, if implemented as a Quicktime component, it should work in iTunes as well (so I can listen to my music collection on a Mac and convert my FLAC music collection for use on the iPod).

Perhaps this will generate interest within Apple to implement a FLAC quicktime codec or, at least, bundle Josh's handiwork described above--perhaps compensating him for his time.

See: http://www.macworld.com/weblogs/editors/

Giving Apple Some FLAC

A few days ago I spent some time exploring the FLAC music file format, which splits the difference between small, lossy audio file formats (AAC and MP3) and gigantic, lossless file formats (AIFF and WAV). Apple supports these two kinds of files in iTunes and the iPod. Now it's time for the company to step up and support FLAC, the fascinating file format sitting in the middle of it all.

FLAC is short for Free Lossless Audio Codec. In other words, FLAC files are free from any of the artifacts you'd find in AAC or MP3 files, and sound like uncompressed AIFF or WAV files, or music played directly from a CD. The difference is that FLAC files take up roughly half the space of AIFF or WAV, making them much more economical for people who want to listen to music without compression artifacts and without breaking the bank buying more and more storage for an uncompressed digital music collection.

FLAC's got all the right attributes. It supports tagging, just like the other formats, so integrating it with iTunes and the iPod would be easy. Right now, though, if you want to do FLAC, your best bet is to use xACT, a really nice utility, but it's no iTunes.

Today, FLAC is mostly used for the distribution of live music online. Bands like Phish and Metallica use FLAC because it's lossless (there's that word again) and because their fans demand high-quality audio files.

FLAC's not for everyone. But it fills a hole in the current format list supported by iTunes and the iPod. So, um, whaddaya say, Apple?

QuickTime FLAC component?

Reply #24 –
What is the current status of this project?