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Topic: Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2 (Read 9428 times) previous topic - next topic
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Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Hello.  You probably remember me from an earlier thread about "remastering" a live show.  This isn't about a live show but 2 songs from demos.

1.  This song "The Twistinside"( http://www.hungryandhollow.com/alex/twistsample.flac ) is an ANA(M) from a 95 band demo tape.  I doubt that any mastering was done to it.  The quality is great, and after several transfer attempts, this is about as good as it is going to get.  However, I was wondering if there is anything I can do to make the sound sharper, sound better?

2.  This song is an interesting case. "Marryin' Kind" ( http://www.hungryandhollow.com/alex/marrysample.flac ) was recorded by the artist alone in 1990.  It was not mastered properly, you have to hear it to know what I'm talking about.  I can't explain it, but it sounds odd.  The quality is good... ANA(?) but maybe an ANA(2) at best.  Is there anything I can do to fix this?

Thank you.

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #1 –
I remember I got some great advice from you guys last time.  Any help is appreciated.

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #2 –
bump

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #4 –
Quote
What do you think of this?


http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....showtopic=31341
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I will check this out later tonight. 

I got a suggestion for marryin' kind - "I pulled 320Hz down by 9 dB and I boosted 5k by 6 dB. Try that, it sounded nice."

However, I have no idea how to do that.  Could you explain to me what he did?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #5 –
That's similar to what I did, I don't have the exact settings for the eq in front ofme right now.
"You can fight without ever winning, but never win without a fight."  Neil Peart  'Resist'

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #7 –
Quote
Hi,
here is the twist sample mastered:
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....13&#entry272013

comments are welcome.

best regards
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=272014"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


Thank you, I will listen to this later on tonight, I liked your results last time, so I'm sure this will sound great 

I have a question unreleated to this, from the advice that someone gave me above:

"I pulled 320Hz down by 9 dB and I boosted 5k by 6 dB. Try that, it sounded nice."

could you explain what it means and how to do it?  I'm assuming it's playing around with the EQ, but could anyone be a little more specific?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #8 –
We're still waiting for ssamadhi...
I tried a quick "fiddling" attempt on the twist sample; the basic problem is too much bass while too few highs there, so I accordingly adjusted them with the parametric EQ. Additionally, I applied a slight chorus effect like on the old samples in the other thread; I don't like this pure mono sound, it sounds dull and aggressive to me.

What did you do with the old record then, colorfinger ?

Quote
"I pulled 320Hz down by 9 dB and I boosted 5k by 6 dB. Try that, it sounded nice."

could you explain what it means and how to do it? I'm assuming it's playing around with the EQ, but could anyone be a little more specific?

Difficult to be more specific than that. In the CEP's parametric EQ, I'd select two center frequencies, 320Hz and 5000Hz, and would adjust the according volume change to -9 and +6dB.

sample here:
http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....95&#entry272095
I know that I know nothing. But how can I then know that ?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #9 –
Okay, phew, at least you're not the only one who thought this was mono sounding.  It's not my tape, the person who has the tape, let me convert it.  I'm assuming this must be a "mono" recording then.

I still have easy access to the tape if you think maybe I transfered it wrong.  However I doubt it.  Yeah, I was disapointed to find out this was a "mono" recording.

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #10 –
I performed a channel subtraction. CEP almost showed only null samples then, thus there's almost no stereo content. Also, you can see that your flac files have probably very good compression. (What is the ratio ?) This typically appears on mono files.
I know that I know nothing. But how can I then know that ?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #11 –
Quote
I performed a channel subtraction. CEP almost showed only null samples then, thus there's almost no stereo content. Also, you can see that your flac files have probably very good compression. (What is the ratio ?) This typically appears on mono files.
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I have the FLACs at level 8 (if that's what you mean?)

Are both the files Mono(?)  I thought they were but i'm not sure... 

Anyways, these are the only sources for those songs besides the reels...

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #12 –
Quote
I have the FLACs at level 8 (if that's what you mean?)

compression ratio=new file size (flac) divided by old file size (wav)
It should be shown by flac in the command line window.
Quote
Are both the files Mono(?)  I thought they were but i'm not sure... 

I only tested the "twist" sample.
I know that I know nothing. But how can I then know that ?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #13 –
Quote
Quote
I have the FLACs at level 8 (if that's what you mean?)

compression ratio=new file size (flac) divided by old file size (wav)
It should be shown by flac in the command line window.
Quote
Are both the files Mono(?)  I thought they were but i'm not sure... 

I only tested the "twist" sample.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=272345"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]


The compression ratio for "The Twistinside" is  0.434516

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #14 –
Precisionist,

I listened to your sample, and it is interesting, it sounds like it's in a whole different room.  Can't explain it...  The drums are brought up loud, very neat when I listen to it on my headphones.

Eyes only,

I like your sample as well, it is subtle, but it does make it sound good.

Dreamliner, your sample is the loudest of all.  I don't know if I can say it sounds better because you can hear more because of its loudness?  Did you limit or nomalize the sample heavily?

I'd be interested to see how you applied your results...

Thank you

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #15 –
Quote
Dreamliner, your sample is the loudest of all.  I don't know if I can say it sounds better because you can hear more because of its loudness?  Did you limit or nomalize the sample heavily?
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I think dreamliner would never never do this...
As far as I can see, dreamliner didn't apply any clipression, just equalization. He boosted the trebles to much in my opinion, though.
On the other hand, eyesonly's sample sounds to bass-heavy to me, even more than the original. It's delicat to say, but I like my own sample most...
I know that I know nothing. But how can I then know that ?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #16 –
Quote
Quote
Dreamliner, your sample is the loudest of all.  I don't know if I can say it sounds better because you can hear more because of its loudness?  Did you limit or nomalize the sample heavily?
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=273243"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I think dreamliner would never never do this...
As far as I can see, dreamliner didn't apply any clipression, just equalization. He boosted the trebles to much in my opinion, though.
On the other hand, eyesonly's sample sounds to bass-heavy to me, even more than the original. It's delicat to say, but I like my own sample most...
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=273407"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

Precisionist,

Could you post your results as a file I can update the entire song on Foobar?  Also, could you also try Marryin' Kind as well... I'd be interested in your attempts on that too.

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #17 –
Quote
Could you post your results as a file I can update the entire song on Foobar?  Also, could you also try Marryin' Kind as well... I'd be interested in your attempts on that too.
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I don't deal with foobar and don't know how to do that.
I guess I'll be busy with studies this week...sorry
I know that I know nothing. But how can I then know that ?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #18 –
Quote
Quote
Could you post your results as a file I can update the entire song on Foobar?  Also, could you also try Marryin' Kind as well... I'd be interested in your attempts on that too.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=273423"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

I don't deal with foobar and don't know how to do that.
I guess I'll be busy with studies this week...sorry
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=273426"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

That's fine,

how did you get your results through CEP?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #19 –
Quote
how did you get your results through CEP?
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I still have the exact settings, I can post them here somewhen.
I know that I know nothing. But how can I then know that ?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #21 –
Time for me to come clean:

1)  I did boost the treble a bit, didn't sound bad here, but again, my speakers here are not the greatest.
2)  I did apply minor compression just to equal out some uneven peaks.

I worked trying to think of how that band would want a major label record to sound and worked with that in mind without killing the sound.
"You can fight without ever winning, but never win without a fight."  Neil Peart  'Resist'

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #22 –
Quote
2)  I did apply minor compression just to equal out some uneven peaks.

I'd say you shoot yourself into the feet...Doing so has absolutely no sense. (Until now I've been sure you knew that.)
Quote
I worked trying to think of how that band would want a major label record to sound and worked with that in mind without killing the sound.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=274049"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

We can't expect our "fiddling" attempts to sound like pro-masters, we don't even have the single-instrument tracks which are necessary for that. I wouldn't try to imitate anything here, just create your own style. Even considered a imitation, your master is too quiet by far then.
I know that I know nothing. But how can I then know that ?

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #23 –
Quote
Quote
how did you get your results through CEP?
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I still have the exact settings, I can post them here somewhen.
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Please Do.

Quote
I had a go:

[a href="http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index.php?showtopic=31341&pid=273809&mode=threaded&show=&st=&#entry273809]http://www.hydrogenaudio.org/forums/index....t=&#entry273809[/url]
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How did you get your settings?

Could Someone also Try "Marryin Kind" Sample?

Thank you all for your help so far!

Music Tweaking Advice Pt. 2

Reply #24 –
Quote
Quote
2)  I did apply minor compression just to equal out some uneven peaks.

I'd say you shoot yourself into the feet...Doing so has absolutely no sense. (Until now I've been sure you knew that.)
Quote
I worked trying to think of how that band would want a major label record to sound and worked with that in mind without killing the sound.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=274049"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]

We can't expect our "fiddling" attempts to sound like pro-masters, we don't even have the single-instrument tracks which are necessary for that. I wouldn't try to imitate anything here, just create your own style. Even considered a imitation, your master is too quiet by far then.
[a href="index.php?act=findpost&pid=274109"][{POST_SNAPBACK}][/a]



Heh, I know what you're sayin'.  I must say, I do know what I'm doing in a studio and sometimes you have to make some sacrifices, and compression is not always an evil thing.
"You can fight without ever winning, but never win without a fight."  Neil Peart  'Resist'