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Topic: Is gapless MPC encoding possible? (Read 14303 times) previous topic - next topic
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Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Hello,

I'm interested in encoding my CD's (for listening on my comp) gaplessly.  I've tried this with Ogg Vorbis format, and it works perfectly. No pauses or clicks anywhere, just smooth transition. However, I was wondering if I can do the same with .mpc files. I tried encoding a CD in mpc format (standard) and I must say I am very impressed with the quality (and compression).

I'm sort of torn between ogg and mpc... oggs have perfect gapless output, but mpc files sound a lot better. Is it possible for mpc to have perfect gapless output, like ogg does?

Thanks

JS

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #1 –
There should be no gap problem with mpc either.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #2 –
Quote
Originally posted by JS
Hello,

I'm interested in encoding my CD's (for listening on my comp) gaplessly.  I've tried this with Ogg Vorbis format, and it works perfectly. No pauses or clicks anywhere, just smooth transition. However, I was wondering if I can do the same with .mpc files. I tried encoding a CD in mpc format (standard) and I must say I am very impressed with the quality (and compression). 

I'm sort of torn between ogg and mpc... oggs have perfect gapless output, but mpc files sound a lot better. Is it possible for mpc to have perfect gapless output, like ogg does?

JS


Currently the MPC equalizer produces clicks (and the WinAMP
equalizer high frequency loss). You can hear it if the EQ setting at 60 and 170 Hz are very different.

This is the source of click you can hear.
--  Frank Klemm

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #3 –
Quote
There should be no gap problem with mpc either.


Well, according to my experiences, MPC is not 100% gapless (but of course much better than MP3).

I've had a few problems with gapless playback on some of my music. This is my estimate:

- On about 80% of my mix/live tracks, I hear no problems. Perfect gapless playback.
- On about 15% of my mix/live tracks, I hear a very, very faint click. It's darn subtle, though. I had to burn the tracks on CD-R and listen to them on my stereo with headphones to hear it.
- On about 5% of my mix/live tracks, I hear a very noticable click.

To conclude: it's pretty good in most cases, but not 100% gapless for all tracks.

This also - partially - the reason why I use APE/APL for my music for now (bought an extra harddisk). I'm waiting for SV8 and when it's out I'll try again.

HTH
Over thinking, over analyzing separates the body from the mind.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #4 –
Quote
Originally posted by PoisonDan


- On about 80% of my mix/live tracks, I hear no problems. Perfect gapless playback.
- On about 15% of my mix/live tracks, I hear a very, very faint click. It's darn subtle, though. I had to burn the tracks on CD-R and listen to them on my stereo with headphones to hear it.
- On about 5% of my mix/live tracks, I hear a very noticable click.

To conclude: it's pretty good in most cases, but not 100% gapless for all tracks.


Thanks PoisonDan, can you tell me exactly what encoding settings you used (on the command line) to get those files with perfect gapless playback? Did you encode with EAC?

Thanks.

J

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #5 –
Are you using a gapless output plugin?
If not that might be the reason.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #6 –
yep,  I am using Gapless Output Plugin v1.6.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #7 –
What do you use to decode?

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #8 –
For decoding, I am using the mp+ plugin c1.7.9f by Andree Buschmann. Sorry that I did not provide all this information at the beginning...

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #9 –
That is the reason, the gapless bug has been fixed long time ago. There is link on front page to latest version.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #10 –
Thanks Case.

I really should have checked that myself before running in here for help  Yep. That was the problem. Thanks for taking the time to help me out.

JS

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #11 –
a few things:

1. get the new plugin... it makes things a lot better
2. use EAC or make sure your cdrom has accurate audio ripping.
3. i have ripped a lot of live cds and a lot of dance mix type cds, and i have not come across a problem yet.  im not sure if im just lucky, or maybe not listening hard enough, but i am quite well satisfied with the performance.
4. SV8 will (i think) have some way of syncing the tracks perfectly, but im not sure.

hope this helps... oh yea and the newest plugin is always available on musepack.org, PiMPed for easy installation (just run the exe!)

bye

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #12 –
Quote
Originally posted by PoisonDan


Well, according to my experiences, MPC is not 100% gapless (but of course much better than MP3).

I've had a few problems with gapless playback on some of my music. This is my estimate:

- On about 80% of my mix/live tracks, I hear no problems. Perfect gapless playback.
- On about 15% of my mix/live tracks, I hear a very, very faint click. It's darn subtle, though. I had to burn the tracks on CD-R and listen to them on my stereo with headphones to hear it.
- On about 5% of my mix/live tracks, I hear a very noticable click.

To conclude: it's pretty good in most cases, but not 100% gapless for all tracks.

This also - partially - the reason why I use APE/APL for my music for now (bought an extra harddisk). I'm waiting for SV8 and when it's out I'll try again.

HTH







Can you provide two files of these 5%?
--  Frank Klemm

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #13 –
I tried encoding 2 consecutive tracks into wav with EAC (I didn't do anything with gap detecting), and used MPC Encoder 1.01a to encode into mpc. I am using .mpc Musepack plugin 0.92d and Gapless Output v1.6 for playback.

I still hear an obvious gap between the tracks. Is there something I'm doing wrong?

JS

Before, when I thought my problems had been solved.. It's moronic but I was actually listening to my .ogg files instead of my .mpc's!

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #14 –
JS, can you upload the two samples somewhere?
I want to check what's wrong with them.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #16 –
I downloaded the files and there sure is very obvious gap between tracks. The first track has 0.100 secs of silence in the end. Did you encode the MPCs from the same wavs as you encoded Oggs?

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #17 –
This is curious... on the two tracks I have that aren't perfectly gapless, it's only a click. Not a complete lack of sound like this seems to be.

Is the silence present in the original wave files?

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #18 –
Yes, I used the exact same wavs to encode the .ogg and .mpc files. I don't think the problem is with the wavs. I listened to the wavs back-to-back and they sound perfectly gapless (So to answer Trelane's question: silence is not present in the original wavs).

I just tried encoding them again, with the same results. Still that little pause there.

Quote
Originally posted by Trelane
This is curious... on the two tracks I have that aren't perfectly gapless, it's only a click. Not a complete lack of sound like this seems to be.


Do you mean that you have tried encoding mpc's and gotten clicks in your files (instead of the silence present in my files)? -- So, you have the gap problem too?

In case this makes a difference, I will tell you the settings I used when encoding to mpc. I used EAC's "use external program for compression", user defined encoder, extension: .mpc

For additional command line options I have only "%s %d" (without quotes) for source filename and destination filename. (Without these params, it won't encode)

JS

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #19 –
While waiting for JS' answer, I removed manually the silence from the end of track 9. Encoding it gives perfect gapless playback, so it has to be problem with ripping.

Edit: so the wavs were same, then I'm clueless.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #20 –
Quote
Originally posted by JS
Do you mean that you have tried encoding mpc's and gotten clicks in your files (instead of the silence present in my files)? -- So, you have the gap problem too?
JS


I've confirmed my click to be an error on the CD itself (sloppy mixing) and not the fault of MPC. As case mentioned, it's probably a bad rip.

Good luck.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #21 –
Gotcha Trelane...

My wavs are perfect though - no gaps. Only the mpc's have gaps. Can it still be a ripping problem.

...Case?

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #22 –
Nope.

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #23 –
I know this is a little too much too ask, but I really want to get to the bottom of this. I can upload my wavs (44.5mb and 30.7mb) somewhere on the web. Is anyone willing to try and encode them into mpc and see if the resulting files have gaps?

Is gapless MPC encoding possible?

Reply #24 –
You may want to chop of the last 5 seconds of the first wave and the first 5 seconds of the second wave. Save download time